Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Try and look at it this way..

A teacher in your child's school walks in to see a V.P. raping your 10 year old boy. He tells the Principal. The Principal tells the superintendent. Nothing is done.. Nothing.

And he doesn't then go to the police.


And that is ok.


That is EXACTLY what the Penn State Students are saying. EXACTLY!!!!

If it was YOUR 10 year old boy would you HONESTLY be okay with the Principal just telling his boss and letting it go. Really???? I don't think so.

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

@Barb,

I think every Catholic out there in the US (and the world actually) "understands" the disappointment felt by Penn Staters.

We know all too well what it's like to have an institution that is a central fact of your life, be responsible in some way for the most sickening crimes against children. And you don't have to be Catholic to have felt our RAGE and disappointment as scandal after scandal after scandal was revealed.

So no, I don't agree that the issue is one of non-Penn Staters "not understanding".

And here's the thing for me. I don't limit my anger to the men involved directly in abusing children. I think they are sick animals, but I feel the same way about every cleric, every bishop, every cardinal, every housekeeper, every layperson, every choir director, every parishioner EVERY SINGLE PERSON who knew, suspected, or witnessed abuse and kept the status quo. Who let criminal priests prey on children, then moved them quietly to a new unsuspecting parish. Who let priests escape to the safety of retirement or rehab before the law could catch up with them.
And here is the larger point I'm making, I also blame the INSTITUTIONS themselves, along with the individuals for creating an atmosphere where prestige and money trumped the safety and welfare of children.

Every college with a strong sports program pimps itself out to donors, alumni, and media. That's a fact.
It's not necessarily a bad thing, it breeds a spirit of competition and gets some nice perks (both academic and extracurricular) for the student body.

But I am disgusted and embarrassed to see students protesting the firing of JoePa in the violent and outrageous way they did. If my kid were out there rioting over this, his tuition money would be GONE. DONE. FINISHED. Protest the flucking athletic program!!! BOYCOTT your beloved games until the University gets its shiit together and makes some kind of mandate about HOW this happened, WHY it went on for so long, and WHAT they are doing to ensure it never goes on again. That's what people expect, demand, and are entitled to. THAT'S where their outrage should be.

It's like a Twilight Zone episode gone rotten to me, where the perpetrators get all the protection and glory, and the victims are treated once again like yesterday's garbage.

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Bottom line for ME is that I feel disgusted whenever I see anyone (alum or not) make this AT ALL about themselves or their precious institution, instead of recognizing that this is ALL about the victims and how their rights as human being were violated and ignored.

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Posted by nel

Posted by nrthshgrl

Am I the only non-Penn Stater that gets why they are feeling crushed by this? That their beloved alma mater was involved in a devastating, horrifying scandal? How someone you admire could disappoint you to the level it did? There is no question that it is about the victims but, of course people are going to feel fallout from this on a personal level.

I spent a summer working in an orphanage in Mexico. Most of the kids weren't truly orphans but chldren from the prostitutes from Guadalajara. We worked our fingers to the bone, bricklaying, teaching these kids,going over homework, cooking for 129 kids I felt like I was a part of something. I could honestly say that the orphanage gave those kids a chance at a better life. They were taught trades, they were taught how to manage their money, create savings accounts,etc. We built a ranch & a bakery that helped support & feed those children. The kids that worked on the ranch went on to own their own ranches & businesses, raise their own families.

A few years ago, I was thinking about the orphanage, the nuns I worked with & the kids that I was so attached to so I googled it. I was sickened to see that the priest & founder of the orphanage - a man I met & admired - had been accused of abusing children. Whether it's true or not, I don't know He wasn't convicted, he claimed it was political (his colleague was gunned down & our water was turned off by the government when we were there even though one of us saw he had paid the bill. He had to bribe someone to get it back on). He was lauded by Cardinal O'Connor after returning to the States.

If the charges were true, I would want him strung up for slow death. I was crushed that a person I admired could have done such a thing. Someone I believed in. I don't know what to believe happened but I do know that I still believe in the underlying principles that were established in that orphanage. To make a difference in other people's lives, to help the less fortunate & to value every child. Even if some POS priest may not have followed the values he established. Does my personal disappointment & feeling of being crushed mean that I don't care about the victims?

Yes it was about the victims but it doesn't make it less personal to those that have a personal connection to the school. I see why Penn Staters would feel adrift & devastation personally. I don't think that they think their personal disappointments trump the tragedy of the victims. I'm surprised at how everyone is attacking them.

I do think that the open letter does come off as condescending with its first line of how we (the general public) could not understand. But I'm trying to look past it to see the rest of the message in it because it does have some value. And to answer the question, if this was a SUNY school, a small private college somewhere else, I believe the alumni would feel just as bad. It would just be a smaller story.

I agree 1000%. I don't understand how their feelings of devastation and disillusionment aren't understandable or how they take away from the outrage they must also feel for the victims (as many have said they do.) One of my best friends went to Penn State, and he is fully in support of firing Paterno and each and every person involved in the scandal, but he is also devastated that the school he loves is involved in something so horrific. What happened there infuriates me, but if it had happened at my own school, the emotions would of course be more complicated. How is that not normal? How does that take away from anything else?

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

I get how students/alumni can feel betrayed and horrified that the people and place they trusted is not what they thought it was. BUT the rioting taking place on campus currently is not reflecting disappointment in their institution and beloved trusted coach...it is anger aimed at those responsible for hurting their football program by dismissing said coach. You know, the one who pretended not to notice babies being raped. Yes, a 10 year old boy is a BABY.

If that was MY baby, there would be a murder trail pending. I am truly sickened at the actions by all involved from Sandusky right down the line to the janitor who felt like something was off.

BLT...You wanted to know why the school and all those people are being named? Because it was happening in the locker room/showers ON CAMPUS. In hotels as a part of the FOOTBALL program. etc etc etc

This was not a man who showed up for work and pretended to be stellar and then went home and did these abominable acts behind closed doors. He created a charity, adopted helpless prey and VERY publicly RAPED these boys all while using his position and reputation of the school and football program to get away with it. He was drunk with power and basically threw it in everyone's face; like look what I can do, I'll even do it in front of you, I'm untouchable.

ANYONE who turned a blind eye to this should be publicly humiliated the ways those boys were

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

I prefer this open letter. open letter to Penn State Students

Dear Penn State Students:

It’s hard for me to admit that I’m removed from my college years. Because honestly, in my head, I was an undergrad maybe 5 years ago.

In real life, okay, yeah, it was 15.

But. In college, I was pretty involved with the athletic department at my college. You don’t play in one of the best marching bands in the country without being into the football team. We were no Penn State – just a little Division 1-AA team – but that didn’t bother us. We showed up at 7am on the practice fields on Saturday mornings, we sat in the stands and played our fight song, we partied after the games.

And we rallied. We rallied against the administration when they wanted to raise our annual student fees. We staged sit ins.

We raged against the machine; fought for our own empowerment, free speech, the power to CHOOSE the lives we wanted to live.

Thing is.

I’ve been following the story about Jerry Sandusky and what he did to countless young boys. And I’ve read about Joe Paterno’s limited involvement in the case. His non action.

And I GET that he’s had 46 years at Penn State and countless winning seasons. He’s coached generations of students. He’s a lynchpin at Penn State.

But I have to admit, when I read a story like this, I can’t really understand.

Because. Back in 2002, Joe Paterno got a call from a graduate assistant, who actually witnessed Jerry Sandusky having anal intercourse with a 10 year old boy.

And Joe didn’t fire Jerry Sandusky. He didn’t even report it to the POLICE. He, instead, called his boss, and reported that someone had reported that Jerry was “fondling or doing something of a sexual nature to a boy.”

Because, you know, it makes it less of a crime.

His inaction? Made it so that more boys were abused.

At the very best, he turned a blind eye to a man who hurt a lot of people.

At the very worst, he aided and abetted a predator.

I know it’s hard to imagine that the administration at Penn State is doing the right thing here by firing him instead of letting him retire at the end of the season. They are the Bad Guys, the folks who want to charge you more money and enforce rules over how you live your life while at the university. I get it.

But too, I know this.

There will be a day, in the not-too-distant future. Where you’ll remember your college days as if it were only a couple of years ago. And you’ll read some news story about a guy who abused kids somewhere else, and where someone who had the power to stop him did nothing.

And you’ll go into your own kid’s room – the one who’s completely sports-obsessed. And you’ll kiss his cheek while he sleeps and feel a deep-seated rage against a person who takes advantage of a child. Because, as you watch your son sleep, you realize you have the capacity to kill someone who would hurt him.

And you’ll leave his room, and start a halting conversation with your spouse about age-appropriate ways to teach your kid how to ask for help when someone he trusts does something which makes him uncomfortable.

And your heart will break when you think of the other little boys who were not so lucky.

And then you’ll think back to the rioting you did in support of Joe Paterno back when you were in college.

And you’ll finally understand.

This letter says everything that I couldn't put into words.

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Posted by sfp0701

I prefer this open letter. open letter to Penn State Students

Dear Penn State Students:

It’s hard for me to admit that I’m removed from my college years. Because honestly, in my head, I was an undergrad maybe 5 years ago.

In real life, okay, yeah, it was 15.

But. In college, I was pretty involved with the athletic department at my college. You don’t play in one of the best marching bands in the country without being into the football team. We were no Penn State – just a little Division 1-AA team – but that didn’t bother us. We showed up at 7am on the practice fields on Saturday mornings, we sat in the stands and played our fight song, we partied after the games.

And we rallied. We rallied against the administration when they wanted to raise our annual student fees. We staged sit ins.

We raged against the machine; fought for our own empowerment, free speech, the power to CHOOSE the lives we wanted to live.

Thing is.

I’ve been following the story about Jerry Sandusky and what he did to countless young boys. And I’ve read about Joe Paterno’s limited involvement in the case. His non action.

And I GET that he’s had 46 years at Penn State and countless winning seasons. He’s coached generations of students. He’s a lynchpin at Penn State.

But I have to admit, when I read a story like this, I can’t really understand.

Because. Back in 2002, Joe Paterno got a call from a graduate assistant, who actually witnessed Jerry Sandusky having anal intercourse with a 10 year old boy.

And Joe didn’t fire Jerry Sandusky. He didn’t even report it to the POLICE. He, instead, called his boss, and reported that someone had reported that Jerry was “fondling or doing something of a sexual nature to a boy.”

Because, you know, it makes it less of a crime.

His inaction? Made it so that more boys were abused.

At the very best, he turned a blind eye to a man who hurt a lot of people.

At the very worst, he aided and abetted a predator.

I know it’s hard to imagine that the administration at Penn State is doing the right thing here by firing him instead of letting him retire at the end of the season. They are the Bad Guys, the folks who want to charge you more money and enforce rules over how you live your life while at the university. I get it.

But too, I know this.

There will be a day, in the not-too-distant future. Where you’ll remember your college days as if it were only a couple of years ago. And you’ll read some news story about a guy who abused kids somewhere else, and where someone who had the power to stop him did nothing.

And you’ll go into your own kid’s room – the one who’s completely sports-obsessed. And you’ll kiss his cheek while he sleeps and feel a deep-seated rage against a person who takes advantage of a child. Because, as you watch your son sleep, you realize you have the capacity to kill someone who would hurt him.

And you’ll leave his room, and start a halting conversation with your spouse about age-appropriate ways to teach your kid how to ask for help when someone he trusts does something which makes him uncomfortable.

And your heart will break when you think of the other little boys who were not so lucky.

And then you’ll think back to the rioting you did in support of Joe Paterno back when you were in college.

And you’ll finally understand.

This letter says everything that I couldn't put into words.

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Posted by sfp0701

I prefer this open letter. open letter to Penn State Students

Dear Penn State Students:

It’s hard for me to admit that I’m removed from my college years. Because honestly, in my head, I was an undergrad maybe 5 years ago.

In real life, okay, yeah, it was 15.

But. In college, I was pretty involved with the athletic department at my college. You don’t play in one of the best marching bands in the country without being into the football team. We were no Penn State – just a little Division 1-AA team – but that didn’t bother us. We showed up at 7am on the practice fields on Saturday mornings, we sat in the stands and played our fight song, we partied after the games.

And we rallied. We rallied against the administration when they wanted to raise our annual student fees. We staged sit ins.

We raged against the machine; fought for our own empowerment, free speech, the power to CHOOSE the lives we wanted to live.

Thing is.

I’ve been following the story about Jerry Sandusky and what he did to countless young boys. And I’ve read about Joe Paterno’s limited involvement in the case. His non action.

And I GET that he’s had 46 years at Penn State and countless winning seasons. He’s coached generations of students. He’s a lynchpin at Penn State.

But I have to admit, when I read a story like this, I can’t really understand.

Because. Back in 2002, Joe Paterno got a call from a graduate assistant, who actually witnessed Jerry Sandusky having anal intercourse with a 10 year old boy.

And Joe didn’t fire Jerry Sandusky. He didn’t even report it to the POLICE. He, instead, called his boss, and reported that someone had reported that Jerry was “fondling or doing something of a sexual nature to a boy.”

Because, you know, it makes it less of a crime.

His inaction? Made it so that more boys were abused.

At the very best, he turned a blind eye to a man who hurt a lot of people.

At the very worst, he aided and abetted a predator.

I know it’s hard to imagine that the administration at Penn State is doing the right thing here by firing him instead of letting him retire at the end of the season. They are the Bad Guys, the folks who want to charge you more money and enforce rules over how you live your life while at the university. I get it.

But too, I know this.

There will be a day, in the not-too-distant future. Where you’ll remember your college days as if it were only a couple of years ago. And you’ll read some news story about a guy who abused kids somewhere else, and where someone who had the power to stop him did nothing.

And you’ll go into your own kid’s room – the one who’s completely sports-obsessed. And you’ll kiss his cheek while he sleeps and feel a deep-seated rage against a person who takes advantage of a child. Because, as you watch your son sleep, you realize you have the capacity to kill someone who would hurt him.

And you’ll leave his room, and start a halting conversation with your spouse about age-appropriate ways to teach your kid how to ask for help when someone he trusts does something which makes him uncomfortable.

And your heart will break when you think of the other little boys who were not so lucky.

And then you’ll think back to the rioting you did in support of Joe Paterno back when you were in college.

And you’ll finally understand.

This letter says everything that I couldn't put into words.

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Posted by brownie

Posted by mrsBLT


on your comment of boycotting the sports programs - what is that going to accomplish? most of those student athletes were 12, 13, 14 years old themselves when this was happening. why should they be punished for something they weren't involved in and most likely didn't know about? the people involved in the scandal have been fired. why do we need to take away what these students have worked for their whole lives because of someone else's wrongdoings? please don't come back with nasty comments on this; it's simply a question.

WOW, seriously?

A whole program covered up some serious felonies...its too bad for the future players but this isn't about them

Here's what happened at Baylor...why should anything less happen at Penn State?

From wiki:

The Baylor University basketball scandal was an incident in which the Baylor University men's basketball program was investigated and punished for numerous NCAA violations. The scandal broke out after the 2003 murder of men's basketball player Patrick Dennehy. His teammate, Carlton Dotson was convicted of the murder and sentenced to a 35-year prison term.

Shortly after Dennehy's disappearance, the school and the NCAA began investigations into multiple allegations, ranging from drug use among players to improper payments to players by the coaching staff. Baylor self-imposed punishments, which the NCAA augmented to include extended probation for the school through 2010, the elimination of one year of non-conference play, and a 10-year show-cause penalty on resigned head coach Dave Bliss. The sanctions so crippled the Bears that they didn't have another winning season until 2008. It is one of the harshest penalties ever imposed on a Division I program that didn't include a death penalty.

Message edited 11/11/2011 9:36:36 AM.

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

BLT, you are just to close to this to see past your own two feet. If this was NOT your school, I really think you tune would change.

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Posted by mrsBLT

Posted by brownie

Posted by mrsBLT


on your comment of boycotting the sports programs - what is that going to accomplish? most of those student athletes were 12, 13, 14 years old themselves when this was happening. why should they be punished for something they weren't involved in and most likely didn't know about? the people involved in the scandal have been fired. why do we need to take away what these students have worked for their whole lives because of someone else's wrongdoings? please don't come back with nasty comments on this; it's simply a question.

WOW, seriously?

A whole program covered up some serious felonies...its too bad for the future players but this isn't about them

Here's what happened at Baylor...why should anything less happen at Penn State?

From wiki:

The Baylor University basketball scandal was an incident in which the Baylor University men's basketball program was investigated and punished for numerous NCAA violations. The scandal broke out after the 2003 murder of men's basketball player Patrick Dennehy. His teammate, Carlton Dotson was convicted of the murder and sentenced to a 35-year prison term.

Shortly after Dennehy's disappearance, the school and the NCAA began investigations into multiple allegations, ranging from drug use among players to improper payments to players by the coaching staff. Baylor self-imposed punishments, which the NCAA augmented to include extended probation for the school through 2010, the elimination of one year of non-conference play, and a 10-year show-cause penalty on resigned head coach Dave Bliss. The sanctions so crippled the Bears that they didn't have another winning season until 2008. It is one of the harshest penalties ever imposed on a Division I program that didn't include a death penalty.

that's different - all parties involved in that were either players or employees. sandusky is an ex-employee - he was not part of the football program at the time. yes, he was connected to it in indirect ways, but his relationship with joe paterno was personal, not professional, at that time. to imply that a whole program covered it up implies that every coach, trainer, athlete, volunteer, every single person involved in the football program knew about it. the whole program didn't cover it up - mike mcqueary, joe paterno, tim curley, gary schultz, and graham spanier did.

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)

Re: Did we discuss the Penn State scandal? (includes Grand Jury Report)