|
You must be a registered and logged in user to subscribe to a topic.
POTUS Dallas memorial speech
| Posted By |
Message |
| Pages: 1 2 [3] |
Kitten1929
LIF Adult
Member since 1/13 6040 total posts
Name:
|
Re: POTUS Dallas memorial speech
Posted by MrsA1012
Kitten1929 : how would you start with fix what's broken ? No snark, just curious as to what measures you feel need to be taken.
I don't have that answer. People would first have to acknowledge that racism exists, unpack their priveliges, and it goes from there. Like I said in another post, there isn't a level playing field and we have to stop fooling ourselves that there is. Almost every aspect of our country from housing, education, banking, agriculture, etc., have ways of discriminating against people of color. It will take lifetimes to figure this mess out even if people are willing. And we haven't even touched on the Native American history of this country, which technically, isn't even ours (but that's another thread  )
|
Posted 7/15/16 1:18 PM  |
| |
|
Long Island Weddings
Long Island's Largest Bridal Resource |
chilltocam
LIF Adult
Member since 11/11 9141 total posts
Name:
|
Re: POTUS Dallas memorial speech
Posted by Kitten1929
Posted by chilltocam
Posted by Kitten1929
Unless people are actively trying to change their way of thinking, then we're all complicit and racist in many ways. Race is a system of oppression and if people are upholding that system rather than actively trying to change it, then you're complicit in its oppression. Its' not my opinion, it's a fact. I know people think I am being argumentative but I am not, I am not thinking I am better than anyone. I just don't know why people have such a hard time hearing about race. So many people hate our president simply because of his skin color, they think he panders to the black communities, they find every which way to tear him down and deep down, the only reason they can come up with is skin color.
There are a lot articles people can read about white privelige, white fragility, white tears, whitesplaining, the history of racist infrastructure, European-dominated influence, why white is the default in the world, the list goes on and on. We don't live in a post-racial society, and many people simply choose not to see it. There was a civil rights movement in the 60s and we're going through another one right now. Ignoring parts of the problem simply because you don't like them doesn't solve anything.
It was unbelievably eye opening to realize how deeply embedded race/racism is in our psyche. If people don't like what I'm saying, thats OK, I can't change their mind. But it might click for someone to say, wow, I never thought about this before.
Your first sentence starts from the position that everyone IS racist. The rest of your post assumes most people are uneducated about race. That is a horrible way to look at people you don't know anything about -an d I don't mean for the people you are making assumptions about. I mean that is not a way I would want to go through life - assuming the worst in people right up front.
No, I am not looking at the worst of people. Again, the construct of racism is a system that was created by white people - however many hundreds or thousands of years ago - and white supremacy, however benign or blatant people choose to see it, has been engrained in us all over each passing generation. White privelige does exist, and people benefit from it whether they believe in it or not. In some way, shape or form, every single person has had a racist thought, said something racist, made a racist joke...racist people aren't just people who walk around overtly making racist comments and calling people the N word...I know that I have been treated differently and have had opportunities and experiences that would never be available to a black person and I don't think that's right. I don't subscribe to the theory that you just need to pull yourself up the bootstraps to become someone. There would have to be a level playing field for that to happen and there isn't one. Banks target low income areas and restrict access to credit, mortgages and impose overdraft fees that make it impossible for people to catch up. There is a huge racial wage gap that studies have shown pay black men 75 cents to every white mans dollar. When you're caught in a cycle of poverty, everyday basic needs cost more because you don't have the luxury to stock up in advance or buy organic foods. Access to higher education, redistricting, the property tax/school funding disparity...this list is endless and I'm not making this up.
When people clam up at the mention of race and feel like it is a personal attack on them, I can't help them with that. That's their white fragility and white tears. I'd rather people say they just don't care about the racial issues in this country rather than say they don't exist because, frankly, it's more accurate. People have every right not to give a shit about the racial inequalities in this country, but don't get mad at others for trying to do something about it, and don't act like people are making this all up.
Sorry, but everything you have written here makes you sound like you believe that you are the only one who understands what racism is all about and the rest of us are just ignorant and/or racist (inherently or by choice). I am well aware of the injustices faced by many groups who are "not like me". I do choose to read, listen and educate myself. I do care about the injustices. Just because I disagree with you on one very small issue (or maybe many, bigger issues) does not make me racist, ignorant, uneducated or uncaring. Yours (or mine) is not the only correct and valid point of view
|
| Posted 7/15/16 1:36 PM |
| |
|
|
|
POTUS Dallas memorial speech
Are we focusing on that kitten (who eloquently states all she learned and knows) is assuming others don't share that same knowledge? Or that others don't agree?
If it's the first part, I don't think it should matter. If you are aware of this, it should be shared. That's part of the deal to fix things. White people need to talk to others and get them thinking and doing their own research. She's not talking to anyone directly, IMO. She's putting it out there so others can read it and maybe it'll spark someone else to dive deeper.
I keep trying to edit and it keeps screwing up.
But yeah, not everyone is aware of what kitten is writing. Yes, many are. But so many are not. Sooo many. Too many. It needs to be shared.
Message edited 7/15/2016 1:57:25 PM.
|
| Posted 7/15/16 1:53 PM |
| |
|
lululu
LIF Adult
Member since 7/05 9511 total posts
Name:
|
Re: POTUS Dallas memorial speech
Posted by Kitten1929
Posted by MrsA1012
Kitten1929 : how would you start with fix what's broken ? No snark, just curious as to what measures you feel need to be taken.
I don't have that answer. People would first have to acknowledge that racism exists, unpack their priveliges, and it goes from there. Like I said in another post, there isn't a level playing field and we have to stop fooling ourselves that there is. Almost every aspect of our country from housing, education, banking, agriculture, etc., have ways of discriminating against people of color. It will take lifetimes to figure this mess out even if people are willing. And we haven't even touched on the Native American history of this country, which technically, isn't even ours (but that's another thread )
Totally off topic but: Can I just ask what type of background you come from kitten? I am really curious. I would just like to know if you grew up wealthy, upper middle class, middle class, lower middle class, or poor. Also, what generation American are you? I think that all of these things tend to shape people's view of racism in America. I have a guess in my head by the way that you speak about these things and I would just love to know if I am right!
Also, I would love to know how I "unpack" my white privilege.
I am being totally serious with these two things, not snarky.
|
| Posted 7/15/16 2:01 PM |
| |
|
Kitten1929
LIF Adult
Member since 1/13 6040 total posts
Name:
|
Re: POTUS Dallas memorial speech
Posted by lululu
Posted by Kitten1929
Posted by MrsA1012
Kitten1929 : how would you start with fix what's broken ? No snark, just curious as to what measures you feel need to be taken.
I don't have that answer. People would first have to acknowledge that racism exists, unpack their priveliges, and it goes from there. Like I said in another post, there isn't a level playing field and we have to stop fooling ourselves that there is. Almost every aspect of our country from housing, education, banking, agriculture, etc., have ways of discriminating against people of color. It will take lifetimes to figure this mess out even if people are willing. And we haven't even touched on the Native American history of this country, which technically, isn't even ours (but that's another thread )
Totally off topic but: Can I just ask what type of background you come from kitten? I am really curious. I would just like to know if you grew up wealthy, upper middle class, middle class, lower middle class, or poor. Also, what generation American are you? I think that all of these things tend to shape people's view of racism in America. I have a guess in my head by the way that you speak about these things and I would just love to know if I am right!
Also, I would love to know how I "unpack" my white privilege.
I am being totally serious with these two things, not snarky.
White middle class. Not wealthy at all, have student loan/CC debt, came from a "bad" school district. My dad is Scotch-German and my mother is French (born and raised, cam here when she was 6).
It all started for me after the deaths of Eric Garner and Freddie Gray. I just knew I didn't believe that they brought their deaths upon themselves, that there was a whole underbelly of racism that I knew nothing about. I started reading articles and essays and listening to the experience of people of color and realizing there was a disconnect. I listened to other white people and how they feel about privelige. Maybe I was more "in tune" with this because I went to a predominantly black high school, I don't know. But I can't "un-know" what I know now, and it pains me that were really haven't progressed much at all since the 1960s and in fact, may be getting even worse. Unpacking privelige challenges every single thought, norm and standard that we've grown up believing.
Here are some good resources:
Unpacking the Invisible Knapsack
On White Fragility
Why White People Freak Out About White Privilege
Curriculum for White Americans to Educate Themselves on Race and Racism from Ferguson to Charleston
Here is Why Refusing to See Color Doesn't Mean You're Not Racist
Here is How You May be Unintentionally Racist
White Tears, Explained for White People Who Don't Get It
BLM Explained, For People Who Don't Get It
Message edited 7/15/2016 3:23:21 PM.
|
| Posted 7/15/16 2:21 PM |
| |
|
SecretlyTTC14
LIF Adult
Member since 12/13 1770 total posts
Name:
B
|
Re: POTUS Dallas memorial speech
I'm glad you decided to educate yourself but some of these articles are opinion based pieces. Most of them seem to echo the sentiment that even though our society is still dealing with a lot of racism, not everyone is a racist. Which contradicts your opinion that every white person is racist whether they know/admit it or not.
The issue with a few of these pieces is that the authors opinion on some of what they deem racism is actually not an issue of race but an issue of poverty. I've worked with children of all colors in underprivileged areas. They are all affected by poverty in similar ways. The white people in these areas do not get the benefits of white privilege because they are poverty level.
I don't disagree that racism is alive and well today. One look at the comments on social media can prove that. I'm glad that you decided to educate yourself on this topic and maybe your newly found knowledge has lead to you feeling guilty about your privileged upbringing, but if you really want to be educated, maybe you can start volunteering in underprivileged areas. You'll see that not every person in this world (and on this website) is actually racist.
|
| Posted 7/18/16 10:58 AM |
| |
|
ElizaRags35
My 2 Girls
Member since 2/09 20494 total posts
Name:
Me
|
Re: POTUS Dallas memorial speech
Posted by SecretlyTTC14
I'm glad you decided to educate yourself but some of these articles are opinion based pieces. Most of them seem to echo the sentiment that even though our society is still dealing with a lot of racism, not everyone is a racist. Which contradicts your opinion that every white person is racist whether they know/admit it or not.
The issue with a few of these pieces is that the authors opinion on some of what they deem racism is actually not an issue of race but an issue of poverty. I've worked with children of all colors in underprivileged areas. They are all affected by poverty in similar ways. The white people in these areas do not get the benefits of white privilege because they are poverty level.
I don't disagree that racism is alive and well today. One look at the comments on social media can prove that. I'm glad that you decided to educate yourself on this topic and maybe your newly found knowledge has lead to you feeling guilty about your privileged upbringing, but if you really want to be educated, maybe you can start volunteering in underprivileged areas. You'll see that not every person in this world (and on this website) is actually racist.
The word privilege in this context doesn't mean status or money. It means that as a white person, they are less likely to be pulled over, less likely to be followed in a store. In your example, the impoverished white person is less likely to be looked at closely than a POC who is better off. White privilege is something all white or white looking people have, no matter what their socioeconomic status may be. Privilege in this context has nothing to do with what you are saying.
|
| Posted 7/18/16 3:07 PM |
| |
|
SecretlyTTC14
LIF Adult
Member since 12/13 1770 total posts
Name:
B
|
Re: POTUS Dallas memorial speech
Posted by ElizaRags35
Posted by SecretlyTTC14
I'm glad you decided to educate yourself but some of these articles are opinion based pieces. Most of them seem to echo the sentiment that even though our society is still dealing with a lot of racism, not everyone is a racist. Which contradicts your opinion that every white person is racist whether they know/admit it or not.
The issue with a few of these pieces is that the authors opinion on some of what they deem racism is actually not an issue of race but an issue of poverty. I've worked with children of all colors in underprivileged areas. They are all affected by poverty in similar ways. The white people in these areas do not get the benefits of white privilege because they are poverty level.
I don't disagree that racism is alive and well today. One look at the comments on social media can prove that. I'm glad that you decided to educate yourself on this topic and maybe your newly found knowledge has lead to you feeling guilty about your privileged upbringing, but if you really want to be educated, maybe you can start volunteering in underprivileged areas. You'll see that not every person in this world (and on this website) is actually racist.
The word privilege in this context doesn't mean status or money. It means that as a white person, they are less likely to be pulled over, less likely to be followed in a store. In your example, the impoverished white person is less likely to be looked at closely than a POC who is better off. White privilege is something all white or white looking people have, no matter what their socioeconomic status may be. Privilege in this context has nothing to do with what you are saying.
I understand exactly what it means. One of the articles mentioned above talks about white privilege and the health care system. Specifically POC not being able to take time off work to take their kids for wellness visits, not being able to afford the co-pays, etc. The same problem applies to kids of all colors in impoverished areas, it's not just a problem for POC.
I get that it's an unfair system designed by white men but these articles do not prove that every single white person is a racist. I'm not arguing that there is no such thing as white privilege because obviously it exists but it's not so cut and dry. My point was that not every single white person is a racist and those articles are based on opinions.
|
| Posted 7/18/16 3:35 PM |
| |
|
| Pages: 1 2 [3] |
Currently 1039452 users on the LIFamilies.com Chat
|
Long Island Bridal Shows
|
