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Bxgell2
Perfection
Member since 5/05 16438 total posts
Name:
Beth
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Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
I know this might be controversial  but I cannot stop thinking about the U.S. Supreme Court decision yesterday, in which the Court ruled that race cannot be a factor in the assignment of children to public schools. The ruling pretty much obliterated the theory that racial diversity in the classroom is a compelling government interest.
So, I'm going to put it out there - do you think that racial diversity is important for secondary schools? Should the schools be allowed to balance schools and classrooms to promote diversity in the classroom? Is there a benefit to growing up in a racially diverse school environment?
And, if you think it is important, now that the Court has ruled that secondary schools cannot base class and school assignments on race, in what other ways can they achieve diversity in the classroom then?
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Posted 6/29/07 8:56 AM  |
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SweetestOfPeas
J'taime Paris!
Member since 3/06 32345 total posts
Name:
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
I'm going to keep my reply short & to the point 
this country is a melting pot and I believe that racially diverse is the way it should be - everywhere!
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| Posted 6/29/07 8:57 AM |
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Bxgell2
Perfection
Member since 5/05 16438 total posts
Name:
Beth
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Posted by SweetestOfPeas
I'm going to keep my reply short & to the point
this country is a melting pot and I believe that racially diverse is the way it should be - everywhere!
Ok, but, if the schools can't do it by using race as a factor in assigning students to schools and classrooms, then how else can they do it?
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| Posted 6/29/07 9:00 AM |
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2PreciousBlessings
The Perfect Pair
Member since 5/06 19861 total posts
Name:
Best Wife & Mommy
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Posted by SweetestOfPeas
I'm going to keep my reply short & to the point
this country is a melting pot and I believe that racially diverse is the way it should be - everywhere!
ITA!
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| Posted 6/29/07 9:04 AM |
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Kara
Now Zagat Rated!
Member since 3/07 13217 total posts
Name:
They call me "Tater Salad"
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Posted by SweetestOfPeas
I'm going to keep my reply short & to the point
this country is a melting pot and I believe that racially diverse is the way it should be - everywhere!
Do you think the government should force that diversity by intentionally changing school enrollment based on race? What you're saying and what the Supreme Court said are two totally different things.
ETA - Diversity is only one of many problems with public schools across the nation. Redistricting isn't going to solve these problems, no matter how badly we hope it would.
Message edited 6/29/2007 9:13:07 AM.
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| Posted 6/29/07 9:10 AM |
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SweetTooth
I'm a tired mommy!
Member since 12/05 20105 total posts
Name:
Lauren
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Well... this was never done on LI, and it is the only school system I am familiar with. If LI wanted to achieve racially diverse schools, the first thing that would have to be done is get rid of the million and one school districts. If each county had two or three school districts, the lines for who goes to each school could be redrawn based on socio-economic status. It would result that perhaps kids that live across the street from each other go to different schools, but it would achieve diversity, at least for awhile. The lines would have to be redrawn every few years though otherwise it would wind up becoming segregated again.
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| Posted 6/29/07 9:13 AM |
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MegZee
My bunny
Member since 5/06 8777 total posts
Name:
Meaghan
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
admission to a school should not be based on race. and thats all im saying on this topic.
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| Posted 6/29/07 9:29 AM |
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lululu
LIF Adult
Member since 7/05 9508 total posts
Name:
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Posted by Meaghan729
admission to a school should not be based on race. and thats all im saying on this topic.
I agree 100%.
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| Posted 6/29/07 9:32 AM |
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alisonggg
Cutie
Member since 3/06 4749 total posts
Name:
a
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Posted by Bxgell2
So, I'm going to put it out there - do you think that racial diversity is important for secondary schools? Should the schools be allowed to balance schools and classrooms to promote diversity in the classroom? Is there a benefit to growing up in a racially diverse school environment?
And, if you think it is important, now that the Court has ruled that secondary schools cannot base class and school assignments on race, in what other ways can they achieve diversity in the classroom then?
Sadly I can't really answer the second part of your question because I really don't know how...but to the first part of your question...yes, yes and yes
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| Posted 6/29/07 9:52 AM |
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Bxgell2
Perfection
Member since 5/05 16438 total posts
Name:
Beth
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Posted by Meaghan729
admission to a school should not be based on race. and thats all im saying on this topic.
What about schools that were historically segregated? Meaning, schools that had a specific policy until the 60's that persons of a certain race were not allowed on the premises, and as a result, have VERY low racial diversity years later, even though the policy is no longer in effect? These are usually schools in the South.
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| Posted 6/29/07 9:53 AM |
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Bxgell2
Perfection
Member since 5/05 16438 total posts
Name:
Beth
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Posted by lululu
Posted by Meaghan729
admission to a school should not be based on race. and thats all im saying on this topic.
I agree 100%.
That's a different issue though - what I'm asking is, do you think that racial diversity in the classroom is important? If yes, then if you believe admission shouldn't be based on race, how else would you achieve that kind of diversity in the classroom?
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| Posted 6/29/07 9:54 AM |
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cazhley
I ♥ cheesiness.
Member since 1/07 1429 total posts
Name:
Cassie
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
I think diversity in schools is wonderful.
I'm not sure it's the right thing that school governing bodies force it, though. I sway more toward libertarian than utilitarian justice in this matter.
My hope (wishful?) is that diversity is achieved with a more natural flow of people in the population in the future.
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| Posted 6/29/07 9:57 AM |
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lululu
LIF Adult
Member since 7/05 9508 total posts
Name:
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Posted by Bxgell2
Posted by lululu
Posted by Meaghan729
admission to a school should not be based on race. and thats all im saying on this topic.
I agree 100%.
That's a different issue though - what I'm asking is, do you think that racial diversity in the classroom is important? If yes, then if you believe admission shouldn't be based on race, how else would you achieve that kind of diversity in the classroom?
I don't believe that diversity should be forced/created. I think that over time, it will happen naturally. I believe that schools should be completely color blind, but I dont believe in creating diversity in communities where none currently exists. I think that is a mistake.
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| Posted 6/29/07 9:59 AM |
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alisonggg
Cutie
Member since 3/06 4749 total posts
Name:
a
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Posted by cub
I'm not sure it's the right thing that school governing bodies force it, though. I sway more toward libertarian than utilitarian justice in this matter.
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I'm not usually a huge fan of government influence, but the governement forced/supported segregation for so long that I feel that its only right for them for them to foster an environment that will reverse its deep roots
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| Posted 6/29/07 10:00 AM |
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cazhley
I ♥ cheesiness.
Member since 1/07 1429 total posts
Name:
Cassie
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Posted by alisonggg
Posted by cub
I'm not sure it's the right thing that school governing bodies force it, though. I sway more toward libertarian than utilitarian justice in this matter.
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I'm not usually a huge fan of government influence, but the governement forced/supported segregation for so long that I feel that its only right for them for them to foster an environment that will reverse its deep roots
Yes, in some cases, of course, such as in Brown vs Bd of Ed. A student was prevented from attending school because of race. There I feel government does have a responsibility to protect the right.
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| Posted 6/29/07 10:03 AM |
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MichelleR
my Becks
Member since 5/05 1772 total posts
Name:
tracyg
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Posted by lululu
Posted by Bxgell2
Posted by lululu
Posted by Meaghan729
admission to a school should not be based on race. and thats all im saying on this topic.
I agree 100%.
That's a different issue though - what I'm asking is, do you think that racial diversity in the classroom is important? If yes, then if you believe admission shouldn't be based on race, how else would you achieve that kind of diversity in the classroom?
I don't believe that diversity should be forced/created. I think that over time, it will happen naturally. I believe that schools should be completely color blind, but I dont believe in creating diversity in communities where none currently exists. I think that is a mistake.
I totally agree.
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| Posted 6/29/07 10:06 AM |
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munchkinbugs
My little loves!
Member since 1/06 8093 total posts
Name:
Lisa
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Having gone to a predominantly white HS I definately think there should be more diversity. I wasn't really exposed to other races and cultures until I went to college.
I think we may understand each and be more tolerant of other cultures if we grow up being friends at a young age.
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| Posted 6/29/07 10:07 AM |
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MikesWife
Wanting...........
Member since 1/06 6887 total posts
Name:
Karen
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Why start in secondary schools? If the government is going to step in and force racial diversity, why not do it at the primary grade levels? By the time you are in secondary school, you have your friends, a pretty well formulated opinion, etc. etc.
Much like the college I went to, Stony Brook, while it is extremely diverse, it was a very segregated diversity. I see this happening if we wait until high school.
I think in order to make an impact, the diversity needs to happen before high school.
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| Posted 6/29/07 10:13 AM |
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Ltdentway99
LIF Adult
Member since 9/06 1752 total posts
Name:
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
There's so much more to diversity than just race... there's diversity in ideas, culture, etc. I don't think the government should force it. By forcing diversity, you end up discriminating.
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| Posted 6/29/07 10:20 AM |
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GioiaMia
Let's Go Rangers!
Member since 1/07 14818 total posts
Name:
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Posted by lululu
I don't believe that diversity should be forced/created. I think that over time, it will happen naturally. I believe that schools should be completely color blind, but I dont believe in creating diversity in communities where none currently exists. I think that is a mistake.
ITA
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| Posted 6/29/07 10:21 AM |
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Ophelia
she's baaccckkkk ;)
Member since 5/06 23378 total posts
Name:
remember, when Gulliver traveled....
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
it's almost a catch 22.
I went to racially diverse schools growing up.
it is b/c I lived in a racially diverse neighborhood (middle to upper middle class Park Slope Brooklyn)
there are areas in this country that are divided economically, but b/c the poorer neighborhoods are for the most part filled with blacks/latinos, it so happens that the "good" schools are fileld with white kids and the "bad" schools are filled with black/latinos.
busing poor black/hispanic kids to a rich white school does not seem like it helps.
more than race it seems, people have divided themselves socioeconomically...
what they need to do is bus TEACHERS and ADMINISTRATORS into these "bad" schools that will be able to make a difference. Then the kids that go to the "bad" schools will go to a BETTER high school/college...based on MERIT, not on skin color.
nothing should be based on skin color.
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| Posted 6/29/07 10:28 AM |
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JessieQ
Rest in Peace baby Rogan
Member since 6/07 1122 total posts
Name:
Jessica
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Posted by alisonggg
I'm not usually a huge fan of government influence, but the governement forced/supported segregation for so long that I feel that its only right for them for them to foster an environment that will reverse its deep roots
I agree. To answer the original questions, yes, yes and yes. I think it's important to expose children to different races/cultures early in life. Many neighborhoods are still "segregated" by race, but it would benefit children of any race to get to know kids of other races. Our world is getting smaller, and you can't just shut yourself inside a bubble. I think there is an advantage to going to a racially diverse school, especially when your neighborhood is not so diverse (although apparently Clarence Thomas doesn't think it helps, and he went to predominantly white schools from high school through law school). I think bigotry is fueled by misunderstanding and fear of the unknown, and is only overcome by knowledge and a shared experience.
But that brings me to another point, the problem is that neighborhoods, especially in the south but even on Long Island and elsewhere, are so segregated. Bussing kids to different high schools to make sure they are diverse is a temporary fix but does not necessarily solve the underlying problem that there is a huge socioeconoic gap between different races in this country. And there is still so much rascism today- a neighbor (yes he was older but still!) told me when I first moved to where I am that there is a colored family that rents (he had to say "rents" not lives in) a house down the street, but don't worry they're nice people. I have heard of real estate agents steering minorities to certain neighborhoods and away from others, even if they can afford the houses there.
Also I do feel bad for the kids who as a result of these policies have to be bussed hours away and be in a different school as their friends next door. But then again, so did my friends who went to Catholic School, and they just made new friends at their new school, and hung out with their neighborhood friends at home.
But again, at least by making sure the high schools were diverse, they could hopefully increase the understanding and decrease the bigotry of the next generation. Also it made it more likely that every school would get similar funding/teacher quality, no matter what neighborhood it was in.
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| Posted 6/29/07 10:29 AM |
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MegZee
My bunny
Member since 5/06 8777 total posts
Name:
Meaghan
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Posted by Ophelia
what they need to do is bus TEACHERS and ADMINISTRATORS into these "bad" schools that will be able to make a difference. Then the kids that go to the "bad" schools will go to a BETTER high school/college...based on MERIT, not on skin color.
ITA - but that means that they need to pay inner city school teachers the same, if not more, than the suburbs. Which the taxpayers arent willing to do!
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| Posted 6/29/07 10:31 AM |
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KrisT
Two Boys for Me!!
Member since 1/07 5213 total posts
Name:
Kristin
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
I didn't get a chance to respond on the other thread or read the opinion, but I have to agree with a lot of other posters that I don't beleive in forcing racial diversity. I also do not beleive that "diversity" is only achieved by race nor do I beleive that a racially diverse student school will equal a superior education.
A large reason why so many schools are not diverse is simply because so many neighborhoods are not diverse. If we had more diverse communities then we have more diverse schools. But creating racially diverse schools isn't necessarily going to create racially diverse neighborhoods. And who are we to say where people should and shouldn't live.
To be really honest, I don't exactly get the whole "application" process to public schools. Yes, I do understand how it can benefit some students by allowing them to go to different schools, but it does wind up screwing a lot of other students. The practical result is that many students will be bussed out to schools that are far away from their house. I do not think it is unreasonable for parents who buy a house in a certain neighborhood to expect that their children will go to the schools closest to them.
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| Posted 6/29/07 10:36 AM |
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JessieQ
Rest in Peace baby Rogan
Member since 6/07 1122 total posts
Name:
Jessica
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Re: Controversial issue, spinning off the Supreme Court decision
Posted by Meaghan729
Posted by Ophelia
what they need to do is bus TEACHERS and ADMINISTRATORS into these "bad" schools that will be able to make a difference. Then the kids that go to the "bad" schools will go to a BETTER high school/college...based on MERIT, not on skin color.
ITA - but that means that they need to pay inner city school teachers the same, if not more, than the suburbs. Which the taxpayers arent willing to do!
I agree that sounds like a good idea to level the playing field, but just like the bussing idea it's not foolproof. I think the NYC school system did pay more than many suburban LI school districts. But it's still hard to keep those teachers there. Plus as long as school funding is based on local taxes like property tax, it will be hard for poorer districts to compete. And I can think of a few districts on LI that are very poor, and to make up for it get more state aid than other schools, so are technically "richer" if you count the money spend per student. But, their students still aren't getting the same scores as those richer districts. It's a socioeconomic problem. I don't know that there is a simple solution.
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| Posted 6/29/07 10:38 AM |
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