Need advice (sorry long)

Hi ladies,

I am so totally confused....

Last week I met with my RE at Cornell to discuss my next cycle....Long story short, I am being treated by DR B for my minor immune issues....I only have my NK cells elevated, everything else came back normal...I decided to cycle at Cornell but stay with Dr B for my immune issues since Cornell doesnt treat them...

DR B wants me to use Lovenox during my cycle and have the intraplid infusion done before ET.....my RE at Cornell is opposed it..... ugh....I have been at Cornell for 4 years (done 5 cycles there-2 BFP, 1 healthy DC) and had every test done that they offer.....to them I am perfectly healthy (I am also a great responder) ...we are dealing with severe MF...Cornell BELIEVES that is why we are not getting pregnant...Dr B thinks otherwise and believes my high NK cells stop me from getting pregnant...

Cornell told me that they will be coming out with a study (in the next few months) that will change how people view immune issues..it will include the use of Lovenox and infusions ...basically they DO NOT BELIEVE immune issues have anything to do with getting pregnant...

What do I do??...do I listen to Dr B do what he prescribes or forget it and listen to Cornell....at this point I am even ready to try "voodo" lol..so I think I will trust Dr B and go against Cornell...on the other hand I highly value Cornell....so confused....

any thoughts?? TIA

Re: Need advice (sorry long)

My thoughts are this...go with Dr. B!! I know that so many Dr.'s and clinics think that immune issues and those that treat them are dealing in "vodoo" so to speak. However, there are soooo many women that say otherwise and credit immune treatment with giving them their take home babies. I guess for me, as far as I know, but I am no expert on immune issues, there really are few downsides to doing the treatment suggested by Dr. B...so why not? You have given Cornell 5 cycles...why not give Dr. B at least one? if he is wrong...you are in no worse position really. If he is right...well...you might just have your take home baby!!

Re: Need advice (sorry long)

Re: Need advice (sorry long)

everyone here knows im a HUGE dr. B fan.

that being said i would look at it this way -
are any parts of Dr. B's intralipid/lovenox protocol harmful or conflictive with the cornell protocol?? would cornell not be willing to treat you if you add dr. B's intralipids and lovenox? assuming none of what dr. B is offering will hurt your cornell cycling, i dont see any reason not to give it a try.

i had two chemicals and tested positive for immune (including elevated NK) and blood clotting issues. i didnt get my sticky BFP until i did IVF with Dr. B's intralipid/lovenox/baby aspirin protocol. i am a firm believer in immune issues, and i know there are a lot of naysayers out there, but i really feel my body was fighting pregnancy before i started treating the issues. since i have been treating them, i have had a pretty quiet pregnancy . i really dont know if i wouldve gotten to 25w (let alone 12w) without dr. B's protocol.

good luck with whatever you decide!!

Message edited 3/21/2011 11:21:34 AM.

Re: Need advice (sorry long)

Posted by FlowerWife

everyone here knows im a HUGE dr. B fan.

that being said i would look at it this way -
are any parts of Dr. B's intralipid/lovenox protocol harmful or conflictive with the cornell protocol?? would cornell not be willing to treat you if you add dr. B's intralipids and lovenox? assuming none of what dr. B is offering will hurt your cornell cycling, i dont see any reason not to give it a try.

i had two chemicals and tested positive for immune (including elevated NK) and blood clotting issues. i didnt get my sticky BFP until i did IVF with Dr. B's intralipid/lovenox/baby aspirin protocol. i am a firm believer in immune issues, and i know there are a lot of naysayers out there, but i really feel my body was fighting pregnancy before i started treating the issues. since i have been treating them, i have had a pretty quiet pregnancy . i really dont know if i wouldve gotten to 25w (let alone 12w) without dr. B's protocol.

good luck with whatever you decide!!

Re: Need advice (sorry long)

After 2 failed cycles at Cornell my doctor recommended it may be immune related and told me to get a consult with an immune specialist. I went to Dr. b and told my Re his recommendation. He was fine with it. I would do it. I don't think it would harm you in any way. I would talk to your Re again.

Re: Need advice (sorry long)

go with dr B's advice. no questions about it

edited to say that sometimes REs are opposed to things they do not clearly understand or have a knowledge about. seems like your case with Cornel REs.

Message edited 3/21/2011 12:14:35 PM.

Re: Need advice (sorry long)

I would definitely go with Dr. B. MF is supposed to be pretty easy to overcome with IVF so if you're not having any success I would think Dr. Bs approach would be the best. Good Luck

Re: Need advice (sorry long)

Listen to Dr. B. There is evidence that suggests immune issues don't play a role in some people's pregnancy. However, in people who have a history of failures, it seems to work. Take a look at Dr. Kofinas' research and statistics. He treats every patient with Lovenox, intralipids, and steroids. He has only lost three babies in his practice and all of them were due to cord accidents. According to the national rates, he should have lost 600+ babies. Furthermore, Dr. B had the highest rates of healthy babies conceived by IVF in NY. These treatments work! Most REs don't believe in the immune work because it comes from immunological journals and not infertility journals. They just don't have a good background in it.

Unfortunately, us patients get caught in this political debate. You gave Cornell a chance. Try something different this time. My 1 year DD is evidence that these treatments work.

Re: Need advice (sorry long)

Ladies, I don't know how to thank you!!!!

Thank you so much for the great advice!! I made up my mind about going with Dr B's plan but wanted to hear your opinions...all the replies jjust made my decision so much easier now... I will cycle at Cornell but will follow Dr B's protocol....

I am now excited and can't wait to start! Will keep you ladies posted!

Thank you again!

Re: Need advice (sorry long)

Re: Need advice (sorry long)

I went to Cornell and Dr B for opinions after my 2nd miscarriage too

Dr B. said I had elevated NK cells and mthfr he recommended lovenox, metanx, Baby Aspirin, prednisone, and intralipids.

Cornell was against it for nk cells. They said the majority of Dr's and researchers do not believe in it and it's still very controversial for nk cells. My hematoligst said most people have elevated nk cells at some time for many reasons like...( stress, colds, etc).

I ended up following Cornell and just took Lovenox ( for clotting disorders), baby Aspirin, metanx, and also 4000 mg of Omega 3 ( which is a great natural suppressor for nk cells).

I got pregnant again with Cornell and just had a beautiful, healthy Daughter 3 months ago.

Goodluck with your decision. Cornell and Dr B are amazing Doctors. I just wanted to share my experience with the nk cells.

I sent FM too!

Goodluck!

Re: Need advice (sorry long)

I actually got a voodoo doll.

Just wanted to share!

Re: Need advice (sorry long)

I think after you do cycle upon cycle, the doctor that gets you pregnant is the one that got it right.

Most likely it's just the right egg.

I have immune issues and I don't think it's why I didn't get pregnant.

I had immune issues my whole life and had a pregnancy years ago. No problems at that time.

I think that you have to do what you feel comfortable with and can live with.

I liked Dr. B very much but I don't believe his protocols are right for everyone.