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Bridex100
Two Under Two Mommy
Member since 3/08 10420 total posts
Name:
Momx100
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
Posted by drwifettc
Posted by rugratmama
Posted by 2BadSoSad
Posted by rugratmama
Posted by afternoondelight828
Posted by rugratmama
Posted by 2BadSoSad
Posted by rugratmama
Posted by hopingforbaby
Posted by rugratmama
Posted by hopingforbaby
Again, I don't see the big deal. Especially since its a play date for the kids. If just the DH showed up out of nowhere without his wife who I made the plans with I may feel weird about that. If the wife is there though; why is it a problem?
So you don't think it's overstepping?
No, not if you invited the kid over for a play date. Is it just because its a man that its considered overstepping? Would if be an issue if the mom brought the kids little sister for example?
I feel like poor dads cant win in this world. If they arent around, they are bad fathers. If they are around, they are "creepy". DH and I do everything together when it comes to our kid. My parents divorced when I was very young and my dad wasnt around a lot at times so I thank God every day my dh is so active in DS life. Now I have to wonder if people around us think we are werid or creepy though. 
FTR....I try to have playdates cleared out before DH gets home. Because he does have a very long day. On the occasion where a mom stays longer he will say hello, and go about his business.
Playdates ARE for the kids. But sometimes the moms become friends, and it can be a way for SAHMs, like myself, to socialize when you are with the kids all day. Most of the moms I am friends with, are not friends with my DH, nor am I friends with theirs. We have not interacted as couples or families.
If I invited a mom and her kid/kids over and she brought her DH. I would be annoyed and my DH would be pissed, as this guy was. It's overstepping and rude. I always ask to bring my little ones along, and if I can, I leave them with DH. I would NEVER bring DH along, if I knew the mom was home alone and were weren't invited as family.
DH gets PLENTY of time with my kids. 2-3 hours will not hurt.
How often is this happening that it is THIS big of an issue for you? If it is "just 2 or 3 hours" suck it up, honestly. You wouldn't, but the majority of us see nothing wrong with it. Honestly, it is NOT that big if a deal to get your panties up in a bunch about. Let it go, be pleasant and maybe instead of harping on the fact that he is there, get to know him instead so when it happens again, you are just hanging out with another friend.
It's not a big deal. I just don't see how so many if you think
This is the norm. Every other mom I have dealt with, it's just been moms. Maybe it's a SAHM thing? I don't know. I've done weekend playdates with working moms and their DHs weren't around or busy. It's like an unspoken thing.
It seems you know a lot of families then that the dh's don't really want to be involved in outside things with their wives and kids. I LOVE that my dh wants to and has come to tons of things with us. If the father is not working or has some other plans, why not go and spend time with your kids? Just like a mother who might be working or has other plans, the father can easily go to things with the kids too.
Every one of the families that I have playdates with the moms, the dad's are super involved and they do TONS of stuff together as a family, as do we.
A weekday playdate with moms, isn't "family" time. It's a playdate with moms and kids.
to YOU.
It's NOT! It's a playdate.
If I have a weekend playdate and I can leave my other 2 kids home, I would. The playdate is for one kid, usually. I would NEVER bring my whole family, if we weren't invited as a family.
I'm sorry but I think it's you. I have two kids and a husband that works insane hours. I'm in a moms group. Have been in it since my oldest was born. Some of us now have other children or had older children. We've always 100 percent of the time included whatever older/younger children were home at the time. And while our husbands don't usually come to day time play dates on the off chance that one came it would be fine. We do occasionally associate with them as a families and do have moms night out.
I'm sure you'll be annoyed, but I've also brought my MIL to a play date when she was in town. I asked first, but would have been shocked if my friends said no. Would we want our DH's to come to every play date, no because obviously we want to chat and talk about them sometimes, haha, but if they came to one here and there, who cares.
AND I also asked my husband about the pool thing and he wouldn't care!
I am also in a mom's group that is local. Many of the moms know one another well. There are often outdoor playdates and any dad that comes home from work early shows up. I would recognize many of the dads as they would recognize my DH.
I personally think it is more odd that a guy would have a problem with their child's friend's dad being in his home. Not sure what the difference between the mom or dad is. They are both parents of the friend.
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Posted 7/6/13 9:30 PM  |
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Bridex100
Two Under Two Mommy
Member since 3/08 10420 total posts
Name:
Momx100
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
Posted by rugratmama
Posted by hopingforbaby
Posted by rugratmama
Posted by hopingforbaby
Again, I don't see the big deal. Especially since its a play date for the kids. If just the DH showed up out of nowhere without his wife who I made the plans with I may feel weird about that. If the wife is there though; why is it a problem?
So you don't think it's overstepping?
No, not if you invited the kid over for a play date. Is it just because its a man that its considered overstepping? Would if be an issue if the mom brought the kids little sister for example?
I feel like poor dads cant win in this world. If they arent around, they are bad fathers. If they are around, they are "creepy". DH and I do everything together when it comes to our kid. My parents divorced when I was very young and my dad wasnt around a lot at times so I thank God every day my dh is so active in DS life. Now I have to wonder if people around us think we are werid or creepy though.
FTR....I try to have playdates cleared out before DH gets home. Because he does have a very long day. On the occasion where a mom stays longer he will say hello, and go about his business.
Playdates ARE for the kids. But sometimes the moms become friends, and it can be a way for SAHMs, like myself, to socialize when you are with the kids all day. Most of the moms I am friends with, are not friends with my DH, nor am I friends with theirs. We have not interacted as couples or families.
If I invited a mom and her kid/kids over and she brought her DH. I would be annoyed and my DH would be pissed, as this guy was. It's overstepping and rude. I always ask to bring my little ones along, and if I can, I leave them with DH. I would NEVER bring DH along, if I knew the mom was home alone and were weren't invited as family.
DH gets PLENTY of time with my kids. 2-3 hours will not hurt.
Maybe you should have playdates earlier to ensure that the playdate is over before your DH comes home.
I have had some moms literally run to the door when DH comes home. These are people we don't know well. Most people we invite into our home are either friends or people we would like to be friends with. DH doesn't have to be good friends with my children's friends but he is social.
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| Posted 7/6/13 9:38 PM |
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Bridex100
Two Under Two Mommy
Member since 3/08 10420 total posts
Name:
Momx100
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
Posted by rugratmama
Posted by Gertyrae
Posted by rugratmama
Posted by hopingforbaby
Posted by rugratmama
Posted by hopingforbaby
Again, I don't see the big deal. Especially since its a play date for the kids. If just the DH showed up out of nowhere without his wife who I made the plans with I may feel weird about that. If the wife is there though; why is it a problem?
So you don't think it's overstepping?
No, not if you invited the kid over for a play date. Is it just because its a man that its considered overstepping? Would if be an issue if the mom brought the kids little sister for example?
I feel like poor dads cant win in this world. If they arent around, they are bad fathers. If they are around, they are "creepy". DH and I do everything together when it comes to our kid. My parents divorced when I was very young and my dad wasnt around a lot at times so I thank God every day my dh is so active in DS life. Now I have to wonder if people around us think we are werid or creepy though.
FTR....I try to have playdates cleared out before DH gets home. Because he does have a very long day. On the occasion where a mom stays longer he will say hello, and go about his business.
Playdates ARE for the kids. But sometimes the moms become friends, and it can be a way for SAHMs, like myself, to socialize when you are with the kids all day. Most of the moms I am friends with, are not friends with my DH, nor am I friends with theirs. We have not interacted as couples or families.
If I invited a mom and her kid/kids over and she brought her DH. I would be annoyed and my DH would be pissed, as this guy was. It's overstepping and rude. I always ask to bring my little ones along, and if I can, I leave them with DH. I would NEVER bring DH along, if I knew the mom was home alone and were weren't invited as family.
DH gets PLENTY of time with my kids. 2-3 hours will not hurt.
Now THIS I find weird...been reading all these posts and how do the friendships NOT become intertwined. I know my husband has become friends with the husbands of my female friends. Obviously there are different levels to these friendships but he IS friendly with all the DHs. If a mom invited me over and I brought DH, when her DH came home my DH would start chatting with him. Maybe my husband is strange but I would find it stranger that a husband wouldn't befriend his children's friends fathers....
We're not at that point yet with most of my mom friends. I see them during the week, while DH is working. He hasn't met most of the dads.
I don't know how many kids you have or how old your kids are but I know for our family, the dynamics changed a lot since having 2 children in preschool.
I can't imagine DH being annoyed at a father of my son's friend. We like to host guests though. We often invite friends over for dinner so the dads can come too.
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| Posted 7/6/13 9:47 PM |
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Jax430
Hi!
Member since 5/05 18919 total posts
Name:
Jackie
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
I am officially happy that I am a FTWM and don't have enough time for play dates with "strange" people to worry about who is there. Our weekends consist of seeing our friends and family, cleaning the house, running errands as a family, and class at The Little Gym.
In regard to the original scenario, if I thought that it was going to be a swimming playdate with just DD's friend and mother, and the DH showed up too, I would have texted my DH to give him a head's up. He wouldn't react badly though. He'd probably be glad that the whole family was enjoying the pool (not that we have one), and would offer the guy a beer.
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| Posted 7/6/13 9:53 PM |
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twicethefun
Loving life
Member since 7/06 4088 total posts
Name:
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
My son was invited to swim in his friend's pool today, and umm it would have been very weird and even rude for my whole family to go, wouldn't it? Seriously, play dates are for kids not an invite for family. I can't understand, do people actually think its ok to invite themselves places????
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| Posted 7/6/13 10:01 PM |
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GoodThoughts
Dreams do come true
Member since 2/12 2258 total posts
Name:
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
This reminds me of the movie Groundhog Day. Same nonsense over and over.
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| Posted 7/6/13 10:01 PM |
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MichLiz213
Life is Good!
Member since 7/07 7979 total posts
Name:
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
Posted by GoldenRod
Posted by 2BadSoSad
...Other quotes removed
Can I ask, what exactly are you looking for with TWO threads several pages long then? We get that you obviously cannot understand how some of think this is OK, and we don't understand why you are making a thing about it. We all obviously aren't going to agree and that is OK, but I feel like this is going in circles, you know? I am not being snarky, I am just trying to understand what the goal is here? It might be time to agree to disagree, and acknowledge that even though it is not OK in YOUR circle, that in many (and possibly the other circles this mom and DH run in) it is perfectly fine which is why they think nothing of attending as a couple.
ITA. According to the 2010 US Census, there are roughly 35 million families with kids under 18. With that many families, there will be millions who think this is weird, and millions who think it isn't. If it bothers you that much, just speak to the mom, and ask her not to bring her DH over. Debating in circles on a forum isn't going to change anyone's opinions, but talking with the parties involved can resolve the discomfort that you are experiencing. The other mom will either agree with your terms, and not bring her DH over, or she'll disagree with you, and not come over at all. Either way, your issue with her DH is resolved....
I was going to respond the same way GoldenRod did.
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| Posted 7/6/13 10:07 PM |
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Gertyrae
Peace out Homies!
Member since 5/05 20046 total posts
Name:
Gerty ®
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
Posted by rugratmama
Posted by Gertyrae
Now THIS I find weird...been reading all these posts and how do the friendships NOT become intertwined. I know my husband has become friends with the husbands of my female friends. Obviously there are different levels to these friendships but he IS friendly with all the DHs. If a mom invited me over and I brought DH, when her DH came home my DH would start chatting with him. Maybe my husband is strange but I would find it stranger that a husband wouldn't befriend his children's friends fathers....
We're not at that point yet with most of my mom friends. I see them during the week, while DH is working. He hasn't met most of the dads.
Unfortunately, if he has this sort of reaction to other dads he probably won't get friendly with them. By the time my son was two my husband was friends with the fathers of DS's friends. I'm not sure how long you should wait but we thought it better to know both parents. I think in this situation either you need to remove yourself from this play group since the other moms don't seem to have a problem with the dad or if the other moms do have a problem then maybe you guys should no longer include this particular child in your play dates. Obviously most people don't take issue so it's your play groups problem at this point.
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| Posted 7/6/13 10:44 PM |
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DiamondGirl
You are my I love you
Member since 7/09 18802 total posts
Name:
DiamondMama
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Spinoff to playdate and DH.
Dumbest thread(s) ever
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| Posted 7/6/13 10:56 PM |
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KwaaksNest
Love my boys!
Member since 6/10 2825 total posts
Name:
Samantha
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Spinoff to playdate and DH.
i dont get what the big deal is...the DH is there with HIS wife for one, and two its a playdate with the kids, who cars what parent brings them
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| Posted 7/6/13 11:37 PM |
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AScottWolf
I <3 our squish!
Member since 11/10 2237 total posts
Name:
Adriana
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
I'm so confused with this thread. I won't be a parent for another 9 weeks or so but for me it boils down to this...
DH and I want to know who is coming to our house and who is at the house when one of us isn't there. If I invite anyone over for any reason, if they are coming with someone else I think it's common courtesy to let the homeowner know this.
If I were the host I'd let DH, who was at work know what we (LO and I) were doing for the day just because. I'd also make him aware of who may be at the house once he arrives. Again, just common courtesy for us.
I'd be more annoyed that my spouse didnt give me a heads up.
These beliefs still apply whether it's a playmate, or some other event.
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| Posted 7/6/13 11:49 PM |
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meloyellow
LIF Adult
Member since 3/13 1843 total posts
Name:
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
Posted by twicethefun
My son was invited to swim in his friend's pool today, and umm it would have been very weird and even rude for my whole family to go, wouldn't it? Seriously, play dates are for kids not an invite for family. I can't understand, do people actually think its ok to invite themselves places????
but nobody said it was the whole family...it was the child's parent. Why is it ok for the mom to be viewed as an accepted parent for a play date but weird for a dad? Why are dads expected to take a back seat on parenting? It's silly. We should be encouraging men to step up and take on equal parenting roles...not shunning them away and turning them into creepy villains for doing so.
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| Posted 7/7/13 12:00 AM |
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twicethefun
Loving life
Member since 7/06 4088 total posts
Name:
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
Posted by meloyellow
Posted by twicethefun
My son was invited to swim in his friend's pool today, and umm it would have been very weird and even rude for my whole family to go, wouldn't it? Seriously, play dates are for kids not an invite for family. I can't understand, do people actually think its ok to invite themselves places????
but nobody said it was the whole family...it was the child's parent. Why is it ok for the mom to be viewed as an accepted parent for a play date but weird for a dad? Why are dads expected to take a back seat on parenting? It's silly. We should be encouraging men to step up and take on equal parenting roles...not shunning them away and turning them into creepy villains for doing so.
As I understand it both parents were present. I am one of the few moms who hung out with the dads because my son played with their sons and their mom's were at work. I think I got a few fish eyes back then. BUt if its a playdate I guess I am surprised either parent was in the pool
And my dh is very active and takes our kids out with his friends and their kids to the beach, Dave and Busters, chuckee cheese and that's normal because its the men and their kids. I think people are overreacting, a guy showing up with all the moms is different. Its not necessarily creepy but it can be annoying.
Message edited 7/7/2013 1:06:01 AM.
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| Posted 7/7/13 12:52 AM |
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SweetSarj
LIF Adult
Member since 10/09 1592 total posts
Name:
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
I am a SAHM. I do playdates with other SaHM and their kids. I meet moms at libraries and parks, never met any dads.
In this scenario, if I had a pool and invited mom plus child for a playdate: I would expect mom and child only. I would be surprised if the mom and child also showed up with the dad. I would have expected to be told or asked if the dad could come along beforehand. If mom, child and dad were at my home and my DH came home from work, he would not be upset. My DH is very social and welcoming and would interact with the family.
IMO it is weird from a SAHM perspective to show up with the 'dad' without asking or casually mentioning beforehand. No my DH would not be upset, but men are different. I could see how someone might be annoyed by this, as they feel they need to entertain a family. Not saying I agree but everyone has their own feelings.
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| Posted 7/7/13 1:17 AM |
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meloyellow
LIF Adult
Member since 3/13 1843 total posts
Name:
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
Posted by SweetSarj
I am a SAHM. I do playdates with other SaHM and their kids. I meet moms at libraries and parks, never met any dads.
In this scenario, if I had a pool and invited mom plus child for a playdate: I would expect mom and child only. I would be surprised if the mom and child also showed up with the dad. I would have expected to be told or asked if the dad could come along beforehand. If mom, child and dad were at my home and my DH came home from work, he would not be upset. My DH is very social and welcoming and would interact with the family.
IMO it is weird from a SAHM perspective to show up with the 'dad' without asking or casually mentioning beforehand. No my DH would not be upset, but men are different. I could see how someone might be annoyed by this, as they feel they need to entertain a family. Not saying I agree but everyone has their own feelings.
I can understand this bc I know I personally would tell my "mommy friend" if i knew i was going to have my DH with me bc typically he is not around when we meet up bc he's working. I just like to give the heads up ahead of time.
I have gotten to know her and her family as time has passed and while i don't "KNOW" her husband like i know her...he is an extension of her family and I just kind of see it as a package deal. It's not the NORM for him to be around...but if he was (especially during the summer as a teacher) it wouldn't be a big deal. As long as I communicate to my husband that he should be expecting to walk into company, he's fine.
Now, if he were walking in after a rough day and DIDN'T know we had company and the father was there, he'd be annoyed. not bc it's a man in the house...but bc he would be expecting to walk in and strip down to his boxers and shower and instead would feel like he had to greet and be hospitable to our guests.
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| Posted 7/7/13 1:28 AM |
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Xelindrya
Mommy's little YouTube Star!
Member since 8/05 14470 total posts
Name:
Veronica
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
Posted by NervousNell
So it's OK for a strange woman to be in your pool but not her husband? I am just not understanding the issue. It seems like old fashioned gender roles.
i agree..
I read it three times and thought.. ok... AND?!... where's the punch line.
so a man and wife are in the pool with a child and the child's friend while the child's friend's mother is not in the pool (or in the pool, who cares?)
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| Posted 7/7/13 1:35 AM |
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
Posted by meloyellow
Posted by twicethefun
My son was invited to swim in his friend's pool today, and umm it would have been very weird and even rude for my whole family to go, wouldn't it? Seriously, play dates are for kids not an invite for family. I can't understand, do people actually think its ok to invite themselves places????
but nobody said it was the whole family...it was the child's parent. Why is it ok for the mom to be viewed as an accepted parent for a play date but weird for a dad? Why are dads expected to take a back seat on parenting? It's silly. We should be encouraging men to step up and take on equal parenting roles...not shunning them away and turning them into creepy villains for doing so.
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| Posted 7/7/13 7:49 AM |
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iluvmynutty
Mom to E&M
Member since 12/08 1762 total posts
Name:
D
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
Mom/Dad, Male/Female issue aside, I think it's weird for 2 people to be invited over someone's house then to show up as a party of 3 unexpectedly. If my DC and I were invited to someone's house to use the pool and hang out, then I found out that DH was going to be available to come too, I would call the person who invited me and let them know/ask if its ok.....
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| Posted 7/7/13 7:58 AM |
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Deedlebugs
Blessed
Member since 12/05 10281 total posts
Name:
Kiki
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
I have a lot of social anxiety and there was a period of about 4 year where I made my DH go EVERYWHERE with me. He would even have to sit and wait for me at the hair salon while I got highlights. No one knew why he was always there, just assumed we really loved being together. Because of all that time we spent together, we kind of just do everything together still. I love having him around.
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| Posted 7/7/13 8:07 AM |
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EricaAlt
LIF Adult
Member since 7/08 22665 total posts
Name:
Erica
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
Ok. I get just being a dropped annoyed about not getting a heads up like... Oh, my DH is gonna join too. He's off and wants to spend the time with the kids in the pool, etc. Or... I don't swim so DH will take the kids in.
Whatever.
I just dont get why the other DH would be annoyed that kids friends are over with their dad. What's the big deal? Is the wife wearing a g-string bikini at the playdate? Is she flirting? I mean his wife and kids are there too. Was he sitting on the lounge chair having a beer or was he in the water playing with his kids? Sounds like he was playing with the kids in the water being a hands on dad. Great!
Does my DH come to every playdate? No. I have become friends with the moms on the playdates, but would have no issues if the dads came too. Great! More helping hands to entertain the kids.
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| Posted 7/7/13 8:51 AM |
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rugratmama
LIF Toddler
Member since 11/12 432 total posts
Name:
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
Posted by Gertyrae
Posted by rugratmama
Posted by Gertyrae
Now THIS I find weird...been reading all these posts and how do the friendships NOT become intertwined. I know my husband has become friends with the husbands of my female friends. Obviously there are different levels to these friendships but he IS friendly with all the DHs. If a mom invited me over and I brought DH, when her DH came home my DH would start chatting with him. Maybe my husband is strange but I would find it stranger that a husband wouldn't befriend his children's friends fathers....
We're not at that point yet with most of my mom friends. I see them during the week, while DH is working. He hasn't met most of the dads.
Unfortunately, if he has this sort of reaction to other dads he probably won't get friendly with them. By the time my son was two my husband was friends with the fathers of DS's friends. I'm not sure how long you should wait but we thought it better to know both parents. I think in this situation either you need to remove yourself from this play group since the other moms don't seem to have a problem with the dad or if the other moms do have a problem then maybe you guys should no longer include this particular child in your play dates. Obviously most people don't take issue so it's your play groups problem at this point.
In what rule book does it say that the dad's must be friends. They can be friendly. But I didn't know it was required to have them over for pool parties and what not.
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| Posted 7/7/13 9:09 AM |
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rugratmama
LIF Toddler
Member since 11/12 432 total posts
Name:
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
Posted by DiamondGirl
Dumbest thread(s) ever
Then don't post on it.
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| Posted 7/7/13 9:10 AM |
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
Posted by rugratmama
Posted by Gertyrae
Posted by rugratmama
Posted by Gertyrae
Now THIS I find weird...been reading all these posts and how do the friendships NOT become intertwined. I know my husband has become friends with the husbands of my female friends. Obviously there are different levels to these friendships but he IS friendly with all the DHs. If a mom invited me over and I brought DH, when her DH came home my DH would start chatting with him. Maybe my husband is strange but I would find it stranger that a husband wouldn't befriend his children's friends fathers....
We're not at that point yet with most of my mom friends. I see them during the week, while DH is working. He hasn't met most of the dads.
Unfortunately, if he has this sort of reaction to other dads he probably won't get friendly with them. By the time my son was two my husband was friends with the fathers of DS's friends. I'm not sure how long you should wait but we thought it better to know both parents. I think in this situation either you need to remove yourself from this play group since the other moms don't seem to have a problem with the dad or if the other moms do have a problem then maybe you guys should no longer include this particular child in your play dates. Obviously most people don't take issue so it's your play groups problem at this point.
In what rule book does it say that the dad's must be friends. They can be friendly. But I didn't know it was required to have them over for pool parties and what not.
So you think that dad's SHOULDN'T be included?
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| Posted 7/7/13 9:32 AM |
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Naturalmama
Love my boys!!
Member since 1/12 3548 total posts
Name:
Christine
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Re: Spinoff to playdate and DH.
I think this just truly a case of different strokes for different folks. What was that theme song? What might be right for you, might not be right for some? 
For us, my DH wouldn't care. About coming on a playdate with women, about a dad being in our pool, whatever. He just simply wouldn't care. He also wouldn't care if I told him it was for women only...he would just stay home or call up one of his many childless guy friends and hang out. Quite a few of my friends are childless- actually, none of my very closest friends have kids at all. So, when we hang out all together, yes I would find THAT weird, since, there are no kids involved and it is very obviously a girlfriend get together. BUT, when I hang out with my friends that do have kids- I never even think about asking if it's moms only. It is a playdate. If you want "girl" time, plan a day or evening when the DH's stay home with the kids and have a girlfriend day. A playdate is fair game, IMO. But, again that is my opinion and how it works in my circle. All I know is, maybe this is why I prefer my childless friends...less drama!
Message edited 7/7/2013 9:48:20 AM.
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| Posted 7/7/13 9:48 AM |
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LotsaLuv
Us
Member since 6/10 4094 total posts
Name:
F
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Spinoff to playdate and DH.
I wouldn't care about the dad coming and neither would DH. DH would prob just think it was odd that he came with no other dads there.
I try to have dinner ready when DH gets home from work so we can eat and do stuff after dinner, so I would care more that they were staying so late. Maybe the guy has no friends. I feel bad for him.
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| Posted 7/7/13 4:33 PM |
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