Thoughts?? UPDATE

Well, despite our Realtor's kvetching, we counteroffered at $375k. They came back last night with $355,400 (what is with the stupid numbers??!).

It's better... but I think we're going to counteroffer somewhere between $365-$360k, despite our Realtor's urging to just accept the offer. Their offer wasn't communicated as firm, so my interpretation is that we're still negotiating...


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This will be long... I'm sorry!

Our house is on the market right now, in PA. We had it on the market in the fall, and during that time, we had 3 different offers ranging from $350-$360k, whereas we had listed it for $385k.. We ultimately decided to stop negotiations and take the house off the market because we were renovating our new house, and had no idea when the renovations would be done, and did not want to go into contract on our old house and then have to move into temporary housing with the girls, and put our stuff in storage.

I should add, that, we are fortunate - I used my father's inheritance to pay for the new house cash. So we don't have two mortgages, so we have absolutely no pressure or stress in owning two homes right now. If we were to move out, all we would have to pay on our current house is about $800 a month in taces, which wouldn't be burdensome for us given our combined income.

So, the renovations are almost done, so we recently put our house back on the market. Despite our agent's pressure to lower the price significantly, we decided to relist at just about the same price - $382.5- we figured, it worked last time, we got 3 offers, right??!

We've had a lot of interest, a lot of showings in the house. Despite that, our realtor has been putting SO much pressure on us to lower the price, nearly every day. I refused. We have no pressure, we are getting a lot of interest in the house, I don't see why we have to lower the price.

4 weeks after relisting, and we have our first offer, of $344,250.

Our realtor tells us it's a great offer and we should reconsider our price, and seriously consider the offer, and aim to settle around $350k.

Now, if we had two mortages, yes, I would seriously consider the offer. But, given that we had TWO higher offers only a few short months ago, and we have absolutely no pressure to sell this house, I don't see why we should settle right now. Yes, I get that she is anxious - she needs her commission, and she's sick of wasting her time and money on this house, but that's not reason enough for me to settle. For her another $10-$15k doesn't make a difference - for us, it makes a huge difference. It's the difference between walking away even, or walking away LOSING money on the house!

We bought this house for $350k in 2005 as an estate sale. We have renovated each room in the house, including the kitchen and all the bathrooms, and added a whole new floor by renovating the basement, which is a walk-in, with a guest room, a full bathroom and large family room. We also had the master bathroom renovated by HGTV - the estimated cost of the bathroom now is $50k.

So, we asked our realtor to counteroffer at $370k and she was extraordinarily snippy with us when she heard our counteroffer.

What do you think? Are we being foolish and hard-headed?

Here is a link to the house, so you can see what kind of condition it's in...

Staged pictures

Message edited 3/30/2011 8:47:37 AM.

Re: Thoughts??

I understand your situation but in today's market you will not be getting a full return for renovations. How much are the house's selling for in your neighborhood? How much left do you have on your mortgage?
We sold our house in 2009 and we had a set price and we would not go lower than that.

Maybe when your contract is done with your realtor sell the house on your own so you won't have to pay a commission.

Re: Thoughts??

Just by the agents snotty attitude, I would get another agent. I dont like that pressure. If you are bent on getting at least 350, I wouldnt settle. Its not like you have the additional mortgage. I would tell her you are firm with xyz and nothing less.

Re: Thoughts??

Your house is lovely -- beautifully staged, so I am sure it shows very well. There's no denying that.

But as for how much it will be worth to buyer's in today's market, that is really tough to say without knowing what comparable homes in your area are selling for. That's really the key (what you paid for your home in a totally different market and what you put into it in terms of renovations isn't really relevant to the value of your home today). Also, did you overimprove for your area? It's tough to sell a home that is the nicest, biggest, most upgraded home in a neighborhood, because the buyers in that area are looking for a lower price point.

From a realtor's perspective, I think it's really important to know your seller's motivation at the outset. I want to know why they are selling and how motivated they are to sell before I take a listing, and if I think the sellers want to ask to much and aren't very motivated, I wouldn't necessarily want to take that listing (and waste a lot of time and marketing efforts/dollars on it).

It sounds like you aren't that motivated, in that you are not financially pressed to sell, so you want to wait for a certain number (again, can't judge if that's realistic or not). If you were honest with your realtor upfront, then I don't think she should be pressuring you or be upset about your reluctance to lower the price.

However, it is her job to advise you on the current market conditions and help you sell the house, so she wouldn't be doing her job if she didn't let you know that she would recommend a price adjustment. If you are getting a lot of showings/interest, but you've only had one offer, your price is probably too high. Has your realtor followed up on those showings to get buyer feedback?

If I were you, I would take the $340K offer seriously and counter it, but I don't think $370K is a bad counter (it's $!5K less than asking). I would try to negotiate and see where it goes.

The other thing is -- you mention that you want to hold out for $10-15K more, but if you are paying $800/month in taxes, that is almost $10K a grand right there. Add in the cost of utilities and maintenance, and are you really better off holding onto the house (it will cost you that same $10-$15K to keep it another year) v. cutting your losses, selling, and moving on? Not to mention the stress of having your home on the market.

I wouldn't recommend trying to sell on your own to cut the commission out, as the previous poster suggested. Time and time again, research has shown that sellers net more money when they use a realtor, because realtors have more expertise and marketing tools. And there are also safety issues (letting strangers into your home) and issues about buyers having access to see the home if you work (whereas a realtor can show it all day).

Good luck!

Re: Thoughts??

First off, I don't think your agent should be so pushy with you. She is working for you, not the other way around. I would maybe bring that up to her.

I do agree with her that 344,250 isn't a bad starting point, that is 10% off asking. Without knowing what the comps are, I think if you settled around 360, that would be fair.

As far as what offers you received a few short months ago, I wouldn't go by that. That was then and this is now, even it was just 3 months ago. Spring is approaching and there will be more housing inventory and it may force you to lower your price.

Lastly, one thing I learned when we sold our home is that the first offer is always your best offer. I would work with this offer and be done with it.

Re: Thoughts??

It sounds like you are in no rush to get out of the house, which is STUNNING BTW!

However, like the realtor said I would definitely take a look at the comps first and see if the price you are looking for is realistic or not.

Coming from someone who got ZERO offers on our house, due to the dummy realtor overpricing I would definitely try to work with this first offer. Best of luck to you!

Re: Thoughts??

Freakonomics on real estate agents -- wait it out

Re: Thoughts??

As a buyer, we put 3 offers on homes where the offer apparently "wasn't high enough." In all three cases, we walked away. In all three cases the sellers came back weeks later. We declined each time.
Moral of the story:
Strike when the iron is hot! You may lose your buyer in a buyer's market.

Re: Thoughts??

I think you need to see what comps are in your area...

IMO, houses sell if they are priced right for the market. Is your house priced right? If you are in no rush-- I guess you can hold out for the best offer, but you never know when your best offer is coming in-- you may have gotten it already.

The only issue with holding out-- is having your house stay on the market for too long and it gets "stale" and people wondering what's wrong with it.

Sounds like you and your agent aren't on the same page anyway-- but if you have a contract, you need to find a way to work together. She should honor your counter offer as something you are comfortable with and present it. You never know what the end result will be. Good luck!

Re: Thoughts??

Just wanted to add something --

I know a lot of people feel that your real estate agent is being pushy with you and are pointing out that she works for you.

That is true - she does work for you.

HOWEVER - - I see far too many agents in the business who are just willing to tell their clients whatever they want to hear to get a listing and keep a listing and get future business. Basically, they want to curry favor with their client, so they blow smoke...

Maybe it's because I was an attorney before I was a real estate agent, but I view it as my job to COUNSEL my client, and tell them the truth about the market, about their house, about their price point, etc. I am not doing any favors by being dishonest. They hired me to be the expert and advise them on market conditions and other things that they don't have expertise in themselves. So maybe your agent is actually trying to help you by letting you know that she believes you are overpriced and that the offer is a good one. She does work for you, but "yessing you" isn't necessarily working for you, you know?

That being said, all of the decisions, about pricing, making a counter offer, accepting an offer, etc. are ultimately yours as the seller, and your agent should always convey her views in a respectful, professional manner and be willing to hear you out, too. And maybe she is pressuring you or getting snippy, which I agree is not appropriate or productive. You should always feel that you and your agent are working together as a team, that she is on your side.

Again, I really don't know anything about your local market and I haven't seen your house, so you may be 100% on point with your position. But I just wanted to raise the larger point the agent that challenges you or disagrees with you (in an appropriate fashion) is not necessarily working against you and your interests. And the agent that just sits by and lets you make all of the decisions without voicing oppositon, if warranted, is not necessarily a good agent.

Re: Thoughts??

I do agree that the agent should be advising you, but the fact that she's been snippy and pushy would turn me off and I'd try to find another one...I think you should wait it out and try to get a bit better!! The offer is not a bad one and I think your counter is a fine starting point

Re: Thoughts??

Your agent sounds a little bit like an a hole...however, I'd get her to counter to get you to settle around 360 and walk...JMO.

You don't get back what you put in with renovatioins from my experience and at a certain point you just want to walk away.

Re: Thoughts??

If you don't like how your agent speaks to you, get another one. I don't think you should work with someone who you don't like working with. Real Estate is hard enough without working with someone that you feel is too pushy or rude to you.

Meanwhile, regardless if you are in a hurry or not, if your house is higher than every comp on the market, you will wait for this best offer that will never come.

Re: Thoughts??

My first thought is who makes an offer of $344,250? Why not $345,000?

I think you were smart to counter and came down a significant enough amount to be taken seriously. We made an offer on a house that was listed as $490k a few years ago and the counter was about a thousand less than the listing price. We walked away because we figured that the seller just did not want to come down at all.

The house we ended up buying we made an offer for $40k lower than listing. The seller came down $15k, but we only went up another $5k. I think you might get the $350 for it, but that intial offer sounds sort of out there to me.

Re: Thoughts??

Re: Thoughts??

Thanks everyone... absolutely no response yet from our realtor on our counteroffer. I'm giving her one last chance before we give her the 30 days notice that we're dropping her, which is a shame, considering we've given her quite a bit of business over the past 5 years - we've used her to buy 4 homes, and sell 2 homes, and I've referred her to my friends and family, whom she's signed with as well.

C'est la vie... her loss I suppose!

Re: Thoughts??

Re: Thoughts?? UPDATE

Bump for update!