Should we really be surprised?

For what it's worth- I dislike both candidates. But unlike many I was not shocked when DT won and am very surprised at the reaction of most Americans protesting.

Here is an article written before the election:



Article

And here are some after the election:

reasons HRC lost

voting numbers

The fact is she did not get the voting support that the polls indicated. I personally know a few friends and relatives in "swing states" that voted but did not vote for either presidential candidate b/c they didn't like their options. This plus the third party hurt Clinton.

For me personally, I really can't stand the fact that her supporters claimed she was well qualified. I disagree. Like the above article cited- what successes has she had. 30 years in public service (of which she and her family have profited from greatly) she has no record of accomplishments. How is she well qualified.

She has a talent for never being held accountable for any scandal. Since the 70's she has been associated with scandals and comes out unscathed. I have a difficult time believing that she is completely innocent in the numerous scandals since the 70's.

DT is another mess but I am surprised that many are surprised HRC didn't win. The Dems should take some responsibility. They backed the wrong candidate-b/c they felt it was "her turn."

History also has shown that Americans don't vote the same party when that party served 2 terms.

Should we really be surprised?

I agree 100%. I did not vote for either, but, as a Republican, I would have voted for Sanders. I know many who felt the same. Bernie Sanders was treated horribly, by his own party. I am very sad he did not win the nomination, I feel like he was the only one who TRULY cared about us middle class Americans. Clinton failed in 2008, and she failed again in 2016. She is a polarizing person. I said it from the beginning- put Clinton against any Republican, she will lose. Sanders would have blown Trump away. Oh well. Too late now.

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Posted by JP826

Posted by GoldenRod

Posted by JDandMe

History also has shown that Americans don't vote the same party when that party served 2 terms.

Reagan (R)- 2 terms, followed by Bush - 1 term (R)

FDR (D) - 3 terms, Truman (D) - 2 terms
Harding (R) - 1 term, Coolidge (R) 1 term, Hoover (R) 1 term

McKinley (R) - 1 term, Teddy Roosevelt (R) - 2 terms, Taft (R) - 1 term

Grant (R) - 2 terms, Hayes (R) - 1 term, Garfield (R) died in office, finished by Arthur (R)

It often switches parties, but there are several examples where the party stays for 12+ years.

Your like a human Google machine, Rod. I mean that in a sincere way.

Re: Should we really be surprised?

I supported Trump. But I can say, I would not have been surprised if Hillary won. After all, according to the media, Hillary was leading in every single poll leading up to the election, right? Guess the lesson here is not to believe the media.

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Posted by JP826

Posted by GoldenRod

Posted by JDandMe

History also has shown that Americans don't vote the same party when that party served 2 terms.

Reagan (R)- 2 terms, followed by Bush - 1 term (R)

FDR (D) - 3 terms, Truman (D) - 2 terms
Harding (R) - 1 term, Coolidge (R) 1 term, Hoover (R) 1 term

McKinley (R) - 1 term, Teddy Roosevelt (R) - 2 terms, Taft (R) - 1 term

Grant (R) - 2 terms, Hayes (R) - 1 term, Garfield (R) died in office, finished by Arthur (R)

It often switches parties, but there are several examples where the party stays for 12+ years.

Your like a human Google machine, Rod. I mean that in a sincere way.

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Message edited 11/10/2016 5:51:22 PM.

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Should we really be surprised?

I agree with the Bernie sentiment. I voted for him too. I would have voted for him against Trump. I am not a republican. I am neutral. Our state allows me to vote in primaries, thankfully. So I voted for Bernie but Trump in the presidential. So very many of my friends and others would have easily voted for Bernie over Hilary. I think they seriously underestimated that.

I didn't give a damn if the president squats or stands to piss.

Being told over and over again that I had to vote for her as a female, mother, prochoice advocate, minority felt so wrong. We all don't fit in cute little boxes. She just couldn't understand we didn't want status quo. So many weren't happy with what was in front of us. Oddly enough this is going to get worse first. They will blame Trump but currently the future is dim. Premiums of insurance are going up, more oil jobs are disappearing, more pressure for hard working middle class is coming due to the changes Obama has already passed. The pressure from refugees on my local area is already felt. Its tough as it is. All we could hear was "You are deplorable, You are rank and file, you must vote for me, you must, you must, fall in line.. DO AS YOU'RE TOLD, STATUS QUO! CHANGE NOTHING...fear him, he is fear, he is change, he is different, he is not like me, he is that thing, he is horrible.. he is all those things that you fear at night" The wall? please... we have a wall, get over it. That is a laughing joke for most of us.

They (Dems) just screwed up. We would have voted for Bernie by the droves! Most of us didn't want Trump, we just didn't want her.

Re: Should we really be surprised?

I didn't agree with all of Bernie's policies but I did believe he was an honest guy who truly cared about the middle class and who believed in "America first." That would have gone a long way with many Republicans, I think.

Oh well. Hindsight...

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Posted by JP826

Posted by GoldenRod

Posted by JDandMe

History also has shown that Americans don't vote the same party when that party served 2 terms.

Reagan (R)- 2 terms, followed by Bush - 1 term (R)

FDR (D) - 3 terms, Truman (D) - 2 terms
Harding (R) - 1 term, Coolidge (R) 1 term, Hoover (R) 1 term

McKinley (R) - 1 term, Teddy Roosevelt (R) - 2 terms, Taft (R) - 1 term

Grant (R) - 2 terms, Hayes (R) - 1 term, Garfield (R) died in office, finished by Arthur (R)

It often switches parties, but there are several examples where the party stays for 12+ years.

Your like a human Google machine, Rod. I mean that in a sincere way.

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Posted by jlm2008

Posted by JP826

Posted by GoldenRod

Posted by JDandMe

History also has shown that Americans don't vote the same party when that party served 2 terms.

Reagan (R)- 2 terms, followed by Bush - 1 term (R)

FDR (D) - 3 terms, Truman (D) - 2 terms
Harding (R) - 1 term, Coolidge (R) 1 term, Hoover (R) 1 term

McKinley (R) - 1 term, Teddy Roosevelt (R) - 2 terms, Taft (R) - 1 term

Grant (R) - 2 terms, Hayes (R) - 1 term, Garfield (R) died in office, finished by Arthur (R)

It often switches parties, but there are several examples where the party stays for 12+ years.

Your like a human Google machine, Rod. I mean that in a sincere way.

Your kids must love you! You are probably the only parent who actually has all the answers! And I mean that in a totally good way!

Should we really be surprised?

As much as I love Bernie and what he stands for, he would not have won. There is still too much anti-semitism in the country for it to elect a Jewish democratic socialist. It's just the truth.

I am surprised, only because I thought the majority of the country would reject Trump's message of hate and anger and pick the flawed, but consistent candidate.

As for her having 30 years of accomplishing nothing, please do some research. She has done things. Maybe not as much as you think someone should have in 30 years. But, what has Trump done for anyone other than himself? Absolutely nothing. And I thought that would have mattered to more people.

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Re: Should we really be surprised?

I am actually independent. Lean liberal on social issues but very conservative on economic/fiscal issues. So there is rarely a good candidate for me.

I was just talking about your question last night actually. I did not think Trump was a prize by any stretch. However to me, we were presented with two deeply and in my opinion equally flawed candidates, albeit in different ways. I knew there was pretty much nothing that could make me vote for Clinton. She terrified me with the way she was above the law and did not flinch at putting our nation at risk. So those were the choices.

If Bernie had been a choice I definitely would have seriously seriously considered voting for him. And I disagreed with many of his socialist ideas BUT like I said I do believe he has genuine good intentions and the ability to work with people. His being Jewish would not have entered the consideration process one iota (for me).

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Message edited 11/11/2016 11:34:18 AM.

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Posted by eroxgirl

Posted by Naturalmama

Posted by ChilisWife

I am actually independent. Lean liberal on social issues but very conservative on economic/fiscal issues. So there is rarely a good candidate for me.

I was just talking about your question last night actually. I did not think Trump was a prize by any stretch. However to me, we were presented with two deeply and in my opinion equally flawed candidates, albeit in different ways. I knew there was pretty much nothing that could make me vote for Clinton. She terrified me with the way she was above the law and did not flinch at putting our nation at risk. So those were the choices.

If Bernie had been a choice I definitely would have seriously seriously considered voting for him. And I disagreed with many of his socialist ideas BUT like I said I do believe he has genuine good intentions and the ability to work with people. His being Jewish would not have entered the consideration process one iota (for me).

Pretty much this exactly. I am a registered Republican, I have never voted for a Democrat in the presidential election. However, I would. If there was a Democratic candidate I could get behind, I would vote for him or her in a heartbeat. Bernie was extreme, he does border on Socialist. Surprising, since although I am socially more liberal, I am against socialism. But, I truly believe he really cared about this country. He wanted all of those angry, fed up, working class people- the ones who ended up voting for Trump- he wanted better for them.
I don't think for one second that either Trump or Clinton really cares about us middle class Americans at all. I really don't. They both disgust me. But, all the what ifs in the world won't change what is. The Dems thought they had their shoe-in with Clinton. They were wrong. He won. So...we move on. We do our best to unite as a country and persevere.

eroxgirl, I applaud you on how calm and respectful you have been in these threads. You get your point across without nastiness or name calling. Which is more than can be said for many others, on both sides of this political divide.

Thank you for that. I really, really try because I understand calling everyone ignorant and uneducated gets us no where. You believe what you believe for a reason, and some of us (ME!) like hearing what that reason is. Whether I agree or not is irrelevant. I just like to learn.

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Re: Should we really be surprised?

Posted by GoldenRod

Posted by jlm2008

Posted by JP826

Posted by GoldenRod

Posted by JDandMe

History also has shown that Americans don't vote the same party when that party served 2 terms.

Reagan (R)- 2 terms, followed by Bush - 1 term (R)

FDR (D) - 3 terms, Truman (D) - 2 terms
Harding (R) - 1 term, Coolidge (R) 1 term, Hoover (R) 1 term

McKinley (R) - 1 term, Teddy Roosevelt (R) - 2 terms, Taft (R) - 1 term

Grant (R) - 2 terms, Hayes (R) - 1 term, Garfield (R) died in office, finished by Arthur (R)

It often switches parties, but there are several examples where the party stays for 12+ years.

Your like a human Google machine, Rod. I mean that in a sincere way.

Your kids must love you! You are probably the only parent who actually has all the answers! And I mean that in a totally good way!

DS (13yo) takes after me He loves facts, and is always looking up random info of all types.
On the rare occasions when DC ask me a question that I don't already have the answer to, I either look it up, and/or I tell DC to look it up. If they have a question, they should find the answer. I also tell them to assume everything on-line is wrong until you can verify it. I'm trying to instill in them early on to not spread Internet rumors or false information.