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McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
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GoldenRod
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Shawn
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McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
This is a legal/food/parenting/business topic, so I wasn't sure where it should go....
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/health/2011/11/30/mcdonalds-skirts-ban-charges-10-cents-per-happy-meal-toy/
A ban against toy giveaways with high-fat meals doesn’t seem to have fazed San Francisco McDonald’s franchise owners. They’ve found a way to circumvent it.
Instead of doing away with the small Happy Meal toys that usually come free with each Happy Meal purchased, San Francisco McDonald’s owners will now charge 10 cents for the trinket. They say the extra money will go toward the Ronald McDonald House, a McDonald’s charity that supports sick children and their families.
Last fall, the city passed the Healthy Food Incentives Ordinance, which prohibits chain restaurants from giving away toys with high-fat, high-sugar food orders that do not meet San Francisco’s nutrition standards. The ruling takes effect Thursday.
Scott Rodrick, owner of 10 of the 19 McDonald’s in San Francisco, told the San Francisco Chronicle that the 10 cent cost “complies with the letter of the law.
“This law is not what my customers wanted or asked for, but the law’s the law,” he told the newspaper.
Keith Ayoob, associate professor of pediatrics at Albert Einstein College of Medicine in New York, criticized the city government for focusing on the wrong parts of childhood obesity, saying that the ordinance is really about politics, not nutrition.
“It’s misguided to think that this is going to combat childhood obesity,” said Ayoob, who grew up in San Francisco. “We should be focusing on school lunches, where there are a lot more calories and fat than Happy Meals, and what kids are eating at home.”
Ayoob pointed out that a Happy Meal isn’t a supersize meal, and has much fewer calories than most other items on McDonald’s menu.
“These politicians want to be seen as childhood advocates, and they were probably feeling the pressure to do something,” said Ayoob. “But their efforts are misguided. If they really want to be seen as that, they should be doing something like mandating physical education for all grades in the school system.”
But Dr. David Katz, director of the Yale Prevention Center, supports the toy ban, saying that the toys and the trinkets “clearly goad children to prefer and request less nutritional meals.”
He said the 10-cent charge shifts the toy, and less nutritious meals, from default mode and into parental decision-making.
Some argue that the ban smacks of “nanny politics,” the Chronicle reported.
“We should not be nannies, but we should not be ninnies either,” said Katz. “McDonald’s puts toys in those meals because well-paid executives have advised them that doing so would drive demand and sales. Parents need to exercise responsibility, but the defaults in our culture should not conspire against the weight and health of kids. No reason to make the job tougher than it already is.”
I think it's pretty funny that they so easily got around the ban.
Anytime my DS doesn't like the toy that comes with the 6 piece nugget Happy Meal, with apple slices and milk, he gets a 10 piece nugget meal with bigger fries and soda (his choice), so where's the health benefit for kids like that?
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Posted 12/1/11 7:47 AM  |
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Little-J-Mommy
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Member since 5/06 8041 total posts
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D
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by GoldenRod
I think it's pretty funny that they so easily got around the ban.
Anytime my DS doesn't like the toy that comes with the 6 piece nugget Happy Meal, with apple slices and milk, he gets a 10 piece nugget meal with bigger fries and soda (his choice), so where's the health benefit for kids like that?
IMO, nobody goes to McD's for a "healthy" meal. I can count on one hand how many times we've given it to my 5 year old. I think he's actually eaten the nuggets once (but my kid is weird  he'd rather just have apples). For the most part, I think it's considered a treat and I don't see the real harm in getting a toy with your treat. I think it's the parents responsibility to instill healthy eating habits. No offense GR, but even though it's your kid's choice to get the larger, less healthy option when he doesn't like the toy, it's YOUR choice to buy it for him, kwim. You as the parent CAN just say, "you get the happy meal with apples or we go home and have pb&j, your choice" (so they *think* it's their choice). Again, this of course is JMO
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| Posted 12/1/11 8:53 AM |
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GoldenRod
10 years on LIF!
Member since 11/06 26792 total posts
Name:
Shawn
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by Little-J-Mommy
Posted by GoldenRod
I think it's pretty funny that they so easily got around the ban.
Anytime my DS doesn't like the toy that comes with the 6 piece nugget Happy Meal, with apple slices and milk, he gets a 10 piece nugget meal with bigger fries and soda (his choice), so where's the health benefit for kids like that?
IMO, nobody goes to McD's for a "healthy" meal. I can count on one hand how many times we've given it to my 5 year old. I think he's actually eaten the nuggets once (but my kid is weird he'd rather just have apples). For the most part, I think it's considered a treat and I don't see the real harm in getting a toy with your treat. I think it's the parents responsibility to instill healthy eating habits. No offense GR, but even though it's your kid's choice to get the larger, less healthy option when he doesn't like the toy, it's YOUR choice to buy it for him, kwim. You as the parent CAN just say, "you get the happy meal with apples or we go home and have pb&j, your choice" (so they *think* it's their choice). Again, this of course is JMO
It's his choice because he earns it. He eats healthier, and has healthier habits than probably 95% of Americans. He only eats when he's hungry, and he stops when he's full, even it it's mid-bite. Since he eats the way that experts say everyone is supposed to eat, I let him decide when he is hungry. If all people ate the way he does, there would be no obesity in the US. I'm not going to mess with what is built in to him.
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| Posted 12/1/11 8:59 AM |
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Little-J-Mommy
I'm a Big Brother
Member since 5/06 8041 total posts
Name:
D
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by GoldenRod
Posted by Little-J-Mommy
Posted by GoldenRod
I think it's pretty funny that they so easily got around the ban.
Anytime my DS doesn't like the toy that comes with the 6 piece nugget Happy Meal, with apple slices and milk, he gets a 10 piece nugget meal with bigger fries and soda (his choice), so where's the health benefit for kids like that?
IMO, nobody goes to McD's for a "healthy" meal. I can count on one hand how many times we've given it to my 5 year old. I think he's actually eaten the nuggets once (but my kid is weird he'd rather just have apples). For the most part, I think it's considered a treat and I don't see the real harm in getting a toy with your treat. I think it's the parents responsibility to instill healthy eating habits. No offense GR, but even though it's your kid's choice to get the larger, less healthy option when he doesn't like the toy, it's YOUR choice to buy it for him, kwim. You as the parent CAN just say, "you get the happy meal with apples or we go home and have pb&j, your choice" (so they *think* it's their choice). Again, this of course is JMO
It's his choice because he earns it. He eats healthier, and has healthier habits than probably 95% of Americans. He only eats when he's hungry, and he stops when he's full, even it it's mid-bite. Since he eats the way that experts say everyone is supposed to eat, I let him decide when he is hungry. If all people ate the way he does, there would be no obesity in the US. I'm not going to mess with what is built in to him.
OK, but you were asking for a health benefit for a kid like yours. Are you really bringing him to McDonald's and expecting a health benefit?? It still goes back to parenting. I'm sure no one would be singing your praises if you thought he "earned" McD's 4 times a week. Clearly, I get that that's not what you're doing. I was just addressing your comment regarding the health benefit.
eta: and most experts I've heard from say that food, especially unhealthy food, should *not* be used as an "earned" reward. It's better to address the treat as a once in a while treat, but to earn it gives it power that brings feelings of accomplishment and pride. McD's shouldn't really represent that imo
Message edited 12/1/2011 9:30:01 AM.
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| Posted 12/1/11 9:25 AM |
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jilliibabii
Mrs. O'Connor
Member since 6/10 12821 total posts
Name:
Jillian
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by Little-J-Mommy
Posted by GoldenRod
Posted by Little-J-Mommy
Posted by GoldenRod
I think it's pretty funny that they so easily got around the ban.
Anytime my DS doesn't like the toy that comes with the 6 piece nugget Happy Meal, with apple slices and milk, he gets a 10 piece nugget meal with bigger fries and soda (his choice), so where's the health benefit for kids like that?
IMO, nobody goes to McD's for a "healthy" meal. I can count on one hand how many times we've given it to my 5 year old. I think he's actually eaten the nuggets once (but my kid is weird he'd rather just have apples). For the most part, I think it's considered a treat and I don't see the real harm in getting a toy with your treat. I think it's the parents responsibility to instill healthy eating habits. No offense GR, but even though it's your kid's choice to get the larger, less healthy option when he doesn't like the toy, it's YOUR choice to buy it for him, kwim. You as the parent CAN just say, "you get the happy meal with apples or we go home and have pb&j, your choice" (so they *think* it's their choice). Again, this of course is JMO
It's his choice because he earns it. He eats healthier, and has healthier habits than probably 95% of Americans. He only eats when he's hungry, and he stops when he's full, even it it's mid-bite. Since he eats the way that experts say everyone is supposed to eat, I let him decide when he is hungry. If all people ate the way he does, there would be no obesity in the US. I'm not going to mess with what is built in to him.
OK, but you were asking for a health benefit for a kid like yours. Are you really bringing him to McDonald's and expecting a health benefit?? It still goes back to parenting. I'm sure no one would be singing your praises if you thought he "earned" McD's 4 times a week. Clearly, I get that that's not what you're doing. I was just addressing your comment regarding the health benefit.
ITA. I don't think anybody is under any illusions that McDonald's is a "healthy" meal. I don't even think the article was trying to argue that point. What the article did say was that Happy Meals are lower in calories and generally healthier than other items on the McDonald's menu and also come with toys. By getting rid of the toy, you're not doing anything to benefit the kid. They'll still probably eat McDonald's, but like GoldenRod said, they'll probably just eat MORE McDonald's since without the benefit of the toy, they'll go for an adult sized meal. I think this law is pretty stupid and ITA that it comes down to the parent to monitor their child's diet.
ETA: I also find it funny that McDonald's was clever enough to circumvent this law so easily. Clever McD's! 
Message edited 12/1/2011 9:37:29 AM.
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| Posted 12/1/11 9:36 AM |
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GoldenRod
10 years on LIF!
Member since 11/06 26792 total posts
Name:
Shawn
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by Little-J-Mommy
OK, but you were asking for a health benefit for a kid like yours. Are you really bringing him to McDonald's and expecting a health benefit?? It still goes back to parenting. I'm sure no one would be singing your praises if you thought he "earned" McD's 4 times a week. Clearly, I get that that's not what you're doing. I was just addressing your comment regarding the health benefit.
eta: and most experts I've heard from say that food, especially unhealthy food, should *not* be used as an "earned" reward. It's better to address the treat as a once in a while treat, but to earn it gives it power that brings feelings of accomplishment and pride. McD's shouldn't really represent that imo
My DS may not be a good example for this case. However, there are many parents who go to McD's frequently, for various reasons. For parents who are at McD's, deciding on a meal, many will let their DC decide.
Yes, people say that the parent gets to decide what DC eats, but in that same vein, why should the gov't tell the parents what DC should eat. I thought the parents are supposed to decide?
I'm not going to judge how parents decide to feed their kids, and neither should the gov't. I believe that I am doing the best for my DC (from research and first-hand experience from my own childhood), and I would not want the gov't (whom most people don't think can govern, no less decide what is *good*) to try and decide how to feed my DC.
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| Posted 12/1/11 9:38 AM |
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jerseypanda
Life is good.
Member since 1/07 9164 total posts
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Amanda
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
I say good for them! I personally think it is ridiculous to try and ban McDonalds from providing toys in the Happy Meals. It is completely the parent's responsibility to make sure their kids are eating healthy.
IMO a parent should not take a child to McDonalds just for the toy in the happy meal. And if a child asks for the happy meal toy and the parent takes them there whenever they want, then there is a bigger problem than that. I think if a parent cannot tell their child "no" in regards to going to McDonalds then that's an issue. My kids have been to McDonalds several times. We certainly don't go weekly or even monthly. But occasionally we go. My DS knows that when we go there, he gets a happy meal and it comes with a toy. If he asks me to go the day after we just went, I say no... regardless of what tantrum he throws. Period. I will not cave to my 4 year old and give him McDonalds more frequently because he had a meltdown over wanting a toy.
I do not believe for a second that taking toys out of happy meals will address or stop childhood obesity. Toys or no toys parents will still take kids to McDonalds.... it's cheaper and faster. The root of the issue deals with time and money. Time that many parents don't have today to cook healthy meals, dollar menus that make it incredibly easy to fill their stomachs with food (regardless of how healthy it is) so that they don't go hungry because they don't have a lot of money.
Personally, I think it would be better to get rid of the dollar menu than the toys in the happy meal!
Message edited 12/1/2011 9:42:02 AM.
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| Posted 12/1/11 9:38 AM |
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BellaBoo
LIF Infant
Member since 10/10 370 total posts
Name:
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by Little-J-Mommy
Posted by GoldenRod
Posted by Little-J-Mommy
Posted by GoldenRod
I think it's pretty funny that they so easily got around the ban.
Anytime my DS doesn't like the toy that comes with the 6 piece nugget Happy Meal, with apple slices and milk, he gets a 10 piece nugget meal with bigger fries and soda (his choice), so where's the health benefit for kids like that?
IMO, nobody goes to McD's for a "healthy" meal. I can count on one hand how many times we've given it to my 5 year old. I think he's actually eaten the nuggets once (but my kid is weird he'd rather just have apples). For the most part, I think it's considered a treat and I don't see the real harm in getting a toy with your treat. I think it's the parents responsibility to instill healthy eating habits. No offense GR, but even though it's your kid's choice to get the larger, less healthy option when he doesn't like the toy, it's YOUR choice to buy it for him, kwim. You as the parent CAN just say, "you get the happy meal with apples or we go home and have pb&j, your choice" (so they *think* it's their choice). Again, this of course is JMO
It's his choice because he earns it. He eats healthier, and has healthier habits than probably 95% of Americans. He only eats when he's hungry, and he stops when he's full, even it it's mid-bite. Since he eats the way that experts say everyone is supposed to eat, I let him decide when he is hungry. If all people ate the way he does, there would be no obesity in the US. I'm not going to mess with what is built in to him.
OK, but you were asking for a health benefit for a kid like yours. Are you really bringing him to McDonald's and expecting a health benefit?? It still goes back to parenting. I'm sure no one would be singing your praises if you thought he "earned" McD's 4 times a week. Clearly, I get that that's not what you're doing. I was just addressing your comment regarding the health benefit.
eta: and most experts I've heard from say that food, especially unhealthy food, should *not* be used as an "earned" reward. It's better to address the treat as a once in a while treat, but to earn it gives it power that brings feelings of accomplishment and pride. McD's shouldn't really represent that imo
 I don't think food should ever be given as a reward...EVER!
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| Posted 12/1/11 9:39 AM |
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cjik
Welcome 2010!
Member since 2/06 8879 total posts
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
This is ridiculous IMO, and with the lousy economy, this is what San Francisco choosed to focus on? DS loves the toys he gets, and yes the food is junky but he doesn't get it often.
I agree--parents should decide what their kids eat, and taking away a happy meal trinket isn't going to change food at McDs--if people want to bring their kids there they still will do so.
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| Posted 12/1/11 9:42 AM |
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greenfreak
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Member since 9/06 11483 total posts
Name:
greenfreak
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
I never thought about this much until I saw Super Size Me. Of course I knew that McDonalds isn't healthy but if I'm eating it once in a blue moon, who cares?
The documentary had an impact though, and when I saw this guy damage his liver so badly from only one month of eating McDonalds, I decided it's just not worth it since there are other fast-food options that aren't as bad.
As far as kids go, they explain that when you "hook" kids from an early age on the McDonalds food and gimmicks, you're ensuring a life long customer. Of course I have fond childhood memories of it - they made sure of that with their cartoon characters, happy meal toys, and playground.
They likened it to candy cigarettes, and the affect it has on a child's subconscious.
With the epidemic (yes, epidemic) of obesity in the US, you have to start somewhere. Just because the school meals are as bad as fast food doesn't mean they shouldn't both be held to a higher standard. How do you stop the viscous cycle of obese parents allowing their kids to eat as badly as they are, ensuring they learn the same bad parents and become obese themselves? If leaving it up to the parent were the answer, we wouldn't have such a problem.
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| Posted 12/1/11 10:10 AM |
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jilliibabii
Mrs. O'Connor
Member since 6/10 12821 total posts
Name:
Jillian
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by greenfreak
I never thought about this much until I saw Super Size Me. Of course I knew that McDonalds isn't healthy but if I'm eating it once in a blue moon, who cares?
The documentary had an impact though, and when I saw this guy damage his liver so badly from only one month of eating McDonalds, I decided it's just not worth it since there are other fast-food options that aren't as bad.
As far as kids go, they explain that when you "hook" kids from an early age on the McDonalds food and gimmicks, you're ensuring a life long customer. Of course I have fond childhood memories of it - they made sure of that with their cartoon characters, happy meal toys, and playground.
They likened it to candy cigarettes, and the affect it has on a child's subconscious.
With the epidemic (yes, epidemic) of obesity in the US, you have to start somewhere. Just because the school meals are as bad as fast food doesn't mean they shouldn't both be held to a higher standard. How do you stop the viscous cycle of obese parents allowing their kids to eat as badly as they are, ensuring they learn the same bad parents and become obese themselves? If leaving it up to the parent were the answer, we wouldn't have such a problem.
I get what you're saying, but I don't understand how taking toys out of Happy Meals makes McDonald's a healthier option?
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| Posted 12/1/11 10:11 AM |
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jerseypanda
Life is good.
Member since 1/07 9164 total posts
Name:
Amanda
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by greenfreak
As far as kids go, they explain that when you "hook" kids from an early age on the McDonalds food and gimmicks, you're ensuring a life long customer. Of course I have fond childhood memories of it - they made sure of that with their cartoon characters, happy meal toys, and playground.
They likened it to candy cigarettes, and the affect it has on a child's subconscious.
With the epidemic (yes, epidemic) of obesity in the US, you have to start somewhere. Just because the school meals are as bad as fast food doesn't mean they shouldn't both be held to a higher standard. How do you stop the viscous cycle of obese parents allowing their kids to eat as badly as they are, ensuring they learn the same bad parents and become obese themselves? If leaving it up to the parent were the answer, we wouldn't have such a problem.
I think it has a lot to do with each individual's personality. As a child, I got candy cigarettes from the ice cream man, I used to pretend every single pretzel stick that I ate was a cigarette. Yet I have never smoked a single real cigarette in my life. As a child, my parents took me to McDonalds every once in a while. I remember playing at one McDonald's inside playground where I sat on the Hamburgler and Grimmace. I don't even know if I got the happy meals because I didn't eat the hamburgers or chicken nuggets, I only ate filet o fish! I am not an adult addicted to McDonalds.
I still think that just because they have Ronald McDonald as the character for the company, just because they use cartoons, just because they give toys in the happy meals does not mean all children are going to grow up addicted to it. At what point do we put the responsibility on the parents?
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| Posted 12/1/11 10:17 AM |
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greenfreak
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Member since 9/06 11483 total posts
Name:
greenfreak
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by jilliibabii
I get what you're saying, but I don't understand how taking toys out of Happy Meals makes McDonald's a healthier option?
I don't think it does. Perhaps they see it as coercing children into wanting McDonalds more than they already do. Bribing them to eat unhealthy options, if you will.
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| Posted 12/1/11 10:21 AM |
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greenfreak
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Member since 9/06 11483 total posts
Name:
greenfreak
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by jerseypanda
I think it has a lot to do with each individual's personality. As a child, I got candy cigarettes from the ice cream man, I used to pretend every single pretzel stick that I ate was a cigarette. Yet I have never smoked a single real cigarette in my life. As a child, my parents took me to McDonalds every once in a while. I remember playing at one McDonald's inside playground where I sat on the Hamburgler and Grimmace. I don't even know if I got the happy meals because I didn't eat the hamburgers or chicken nuggets, I only ate filet o fish! I am not an adult addicted to McDonalds.
I still think that just because they have Ronald McDonald as the character for the company, just because they use cartoons, just because they give toys in the happy meals does not mean all children are going to grow up addicted to it. At what point do we put the responsibility on the parents?
I agree, each person can be different. But if you stack the deck with candy cigarettes, fast food as a common alternative to a healthy meal, allowing children to be overweight and make bad choices, etc. it leads to a dangerous trend.
I'm not addicted to McDonalds now but I ate it every day in high school. #4 with a chocolate shake. We had the glasses with the characters on them. Collected happy meal toys. Went to birthday parties there. I'm sure I'm not the only one. I'm not *blaming* them for my choices. I'm saying parents have a responsibility to teach their children to be healthy and I don't think anyone considers McDonalds healthy.
It's an exaggeration to say all children will grow up addicted - of course that's not the case, we both know that and I'm not saying that. But with the road we're going down with the fattest country in the world, with the fattest children in the world, and only getting worse, what better ideas are being proposed besides leaving it up to parents who obese themselves?
Message edited 12/1/2011 10:27:07 AM.
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| Posted 12/1/11 10:26 AM |
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DiamondGirl
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Member since 7/09 18802 total posts
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
The whole thing is absurd.
It is the PARENTS responsibility to care for the childs health NOT the fast food establishment.
If I take my son to Mickey D's 5x's a week who's fault is that? Why should the kid who only goes once every other month not enjoy his toy??
Message edited 12/1/2011 10:31:40 AM.
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| Posted 12/1/11 10:31 AM |
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jilliibabii
Mrs. O'Connor
Member since 6/10 12821 total posts
Name:
Jillian
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by greenfreak
Posted by jilliibabii
I get what you're saying, but I don't understand how taking toys out of Happy Meals makes McDonald's a healthier option?
I don't think it does. Perhaps they see it as coercing children into wanting McDonalds more than they already do. Bribing them to eat unhealthy options, if you will.
But the groundwork has been set. Kids will always look at McDonalds as a fun meal. The toy, Ronald McDonald, the play pit, the golden arches, the whole thing is iconic. Removing a toy from a happy meal won't change that. That's why I feel like it's still the parent's responsibility OR there needs to be a change made in the quality of the food. But if they did that, it wouldn't be McDonald's anymore. It would be healthier, but boring (in the eyes of kids and adults, alike, let's be real) and in all liklihood, more expensive, making it another option that people won't use. Then McDonald's would start losing money and they'd sacrifice quality for price and stick some toys back in there to entice kids and the whole vicious cycle would start again. So really, other than banning fast food and having the gov't dictate everything we can and cannot eat to make sure everyone is healthy, what other option is there? There's education, making healthy food more affordable... but you can only lead a horse to water, you can't make him drink.
Sorry, this spiel isn't directed at you GreenFreak, but just my crazy "what if" thoughts spinning out of control.
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| Posted 12/1/11 10:39 AM |
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greenfreak
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Member since 9/06 11483 total posts
Name:
greenfreak
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by jilliibabii
But the groundwork has been set. Kids will always look at McDonalds as a fun meal. The toy, Ronald McDonald, the play pit, the golden arches, the whole thing is iconic. Removing a toy from a happy meal won't change that. That's why I feel like it's still the parent's responsibility OR there needs to be a change made in the quality of the food. But if they did that, it wouldn't be McDonald's anymore. It would be healthier, but boring (in the eyes of kids and adults, alike, let's be real) and in all liklihood, more expensive, making it another option that people won't use. Then McDonald's would start losing money and they'd sacrifice quality for price and stick some toys back in there to entice kids and the whole vicious cycle would start again. So really, other than banning fast food and having the gov't dictate everything we can and cannot eat to make sure everyone is healthy, what other option is there? There's education, making healthy food more affordable... but you can only lead a horse to water, you can't make him drink.
Sorry, this spiel isn't directed at you GreenFreak, but just my crazy "what if" thoughts spinning out of control.
I'm not sure that making McDonalds healthier will be the death of it, look at all the other burger places gaining popularity. 5 Guys for example. It's still not healthy per se but it's better than McDonalds.
Have you seen Super Size Me? I think you'd like it. He went around trying to find the nutritional information that I believe is supposed to be visible at all times. It was comical, him trying to find them, and the employees being clueless.
I watch "I Used to be Fat" on MTV and the majority of the overweight kids have overweight parents. It is shameful how the parents just don't care or think that it's a problem, and are not part of the solution. Meanwhile it's not just the family that suffers, it's healthcare too, and the person sitting next to you on the airplane and all those other problems cropping up because of overweight Americans.
I know it's not directed at me, and I'm enjoying this conversation so no worries!  I wouldn't have even responded a year ago because I wasn't as concerned with my health and I didn't really know much about healthy eating. So this is all new for me too. 
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| Posted 12/1/11 10:55 AM |
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dpli
Daylight savings :)
Member since 5/05 13973 total posts
Name:
D
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by greenfreak
As far as kids go, they explain that when you "hook" kids from an early age on the McDonalds food and gimmicks, you're ensuring a life long customer. Of course I have fond childhood memories of it - they made sure of that with their cartoon characters, happy meal toys, and playground.
If you haven't read Fast Food Nation, or Fatland, those do a really job of explaining how aggressively McD's in particular markets to children, which I think is really the issue.
Yes, it's the resposibility of parents to decide what their kids eat, but for me, the bigger issue is that children should not be targeted for such aggressive marketing, either at McD's or other places. If you are a parent, think about disposable diapers. Can you think of any major brand of diapers that don't have characters on them? These companies start young and get these kids hooked on products because of the cute characters, the toys, etc.
I eat at McDonalds occasionally, my DS does not. Not because I am mother of the year, but mainly because he is such a picky eater, I know he wouldn't eat anything there. I do think, however, that most kids start out wanting McD's because of the toys, not the food. Then, they get hooked on the food and become lifetime customers, which is the whole point of the Happy Meal. I think advocates see the elimination of the toy as a step in the right direction of decreasing childhood obesity.
I know my opinion on this topic is unpopular, and widely disagreed with, but want to put it out there anyway.
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| Posted 12/1/11 11:09 AM |
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HoneyBadger
YourWorstNightmare.
Member since 10/06 15979 total posts
Name:
BahBahBlackJeep
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by GoldenRod
This is a legal/food/parenting/business topic, so I wasn't sure where it should go....
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/health/2011/11/30/mcdonalds-skirts-ban-charges-10-cents-per-happy-meal-toy/
A ban against toy giveaways with high-fat meals doesn’t seem to have fazed San Francisco McDonald’s franchise owners. They’ve found a way to circumvent it.
Instead of doing away with the small Happy Meal toys that usually come free with each Happy Meal purchased, San Francisco McDonald’s owners will now charge 10 cents for the trinket. They say the extra money will go toward the Ronald McDonald House, a McDonald’s charity that supports sick children and their families.
Last fall, the city passed the Healthy Food Incentives Ordinance, which prohibits chain restaurants from giving away toys with high-fat, high-sugar food orders that do not meet San Francisco’s nutrition standards. The ruling takes effect Thursday.
Scott Rodrick, owner of 10 of the 19 McDonald’s in San Francisco, told the San Francisco Chronicle that the 10 cent cost “complies with the letter of the law.
“This law is not what my customers wanted or asked for, but the law’s the law,” he told the newspaper.
Keith Ayoob, associate professor of pediatrics at Albert Einstein College of Medicine in New York, criticized the city government for focusing on the wrong parts of childhood obesity, saying that the ordinance is really about politics, not nutrition.
“It’s misguided to think that this is going to combat childhood obesity,” said Ayoob, who grew up in San Francisco. “We should be focusing on school lunches, where there are a lot more calories and fat than Happy Meals, and what kids are eating at home.”
Ayoob pointed out that a Happy Meal isn’t a supersize meal, and has much fewer calories than most other items on McDonald’s menu.
“These politicians want to be seen as childhood advocates, and they were probably feeling the pressure to do something,” said Ayoob. “But their efforts are misguided. If they really want to be seen as that, they should be doing something like mandating physical education for all grades in the school system.”
But Dr. David Katz, director of the Yale Prevention Center, supports the toy ban, saying that the toys and the trinkets “clearly goad children to prefer and request less nutritional meals.”
He said the 10-cent charge shifts the toy, and less nutritious meals, from default mode and into parental decision-making.
Some argue that the ban smacks of “nanny politics,” the Chronicle reported.
“We should not be nannies, but we should not be ninnies either,” said Katz. “McDonald’s puts toys in those meals because well-paid executives have advised them that doing so would drive demand and sales. Parents need to exercise responsibility, but the defaults in our culture should not conspire against the weight and health of kids. No reason to make the job tougher than it already is.”
I think it's pretty funny that they so easily got around the ban.
Anytime my DS doesn't like the toy that comes with the 6 piece nugget Happy Meal, with apple slices and milk, he gets a 10 piece nugget meal with bigger fries and soda (his choice), so where's the health benefit for kids like that?
I completely agree with what Keith Ayoob had to say regarding the legislature and the politicians giving the illusion of being child advocates.
When the government decides PIZZA is a vegetable, well, to me, that's just proof they don't really care.
I agree, if they want to help kids, the gov't needs to look into what they're serving as school lunches and frankly, parents of overweight kids need to step up and do something.
As far as I'm concerned the ban on toys in Happy Meals is just the gov't's way of blowing smoke up the proverbial ARSE of the general public.
@GoldenRod - I don't understand why your kid doesn't still get the happy meal, regardless of whether he likes the toy or not. If he doesn't like it he could just toss it or perhaps give it back to the McDonald's to use in another happy meal.
Why would you get your child a bigger portion? That doesn't make sense to me...
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| Posted 12/1/11 11:09 AM |
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GoldenRod
10 years on LIF!
Member since 11/06 26792 total posts
Name:
Shawn
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by greenfreak
I'm not sure that making McDonalds healthier will be the death of it, look at all the other burger places gaining popularity. 5 Guys for example. It's still not healthy per se but it's better than McDonalds.
Although, on the Top 10 fattiest foods list, there's a 5 Guys burger, but nothing from McD's.
http://blogs.laweekly.com/squidink/2010/05/fattiest_foods_extreme.php
http://www.livestrong.com/article/262411-five-guys-burgers-nutrition-information/
An average Five Guys meal of a burger and fries means consumption of at least 1,200 calories and 60 grams of fat.
...
a Big Mac and large fries will cost you 1,040 calories and 54 g of fat, according to the restaurant's nutrition information.
(I'm not saying McD's is healthier, just that basically no fast-food place is "healthy")
It all comes down to responsible eating (and feeding). You can get sick and unhealthy on anything in excess (people have died from drinking too much water!....) I don't know of a viable solution, but it needs to come from the parents, not the gov't dictating what is "good". The gov't just said that horse meat is OK to eat in the US, but most people are upset that the gov't allowed that.
Yes, it's an epidemic, but I don't think removing toys from meals is the solution.
Maybe, instead of chairs at the tables, they had recumbent bikes, and you had to pedal to keep the tray up. As soon as you stop pedaling, the tray drops out of reach.
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| Posted 12/1/11 11:15 AM |
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GoldenRod
10 years on LIF!
Member since 11/06 26792 total posts
Name:
Shawn
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by Jennie0898
@GoldenRod - I don't understand why your kid doesn't still get the happy meal, regardless of whether he likes the toy or not. If he doesn't like it he could just toss it or perhaps give it back to the McDonald's to use in another happy meal.
Why would you get your child a bigger portion? That doesn't make sense to me...
He has amazing control over how hungry he is. If he says he's hungry, he's truly hungry. I haven't seen many kids like him. He only eats when he's hungry, and stops when he's full. He's the perfect weight, he exercises a lot, he eats plenty of healthy food, and will turn down sweets. For Halloween, he chose to give out candy at the house, rather than collect candy, since he didn't want any.
I'm trying to instill good habits with him, and when he is able to decide what he *needs* to eat, rather than what I give him, I believe it will benefit him for the rest of his life in a positive way. Growing up, I didn't have much fast food, so I ate "healthier", but I was forced to clean my plate at every meal. That's still stuck with me, even though I know it's a major reason why I'm overweight. Eating too much "healthy" food isn't good either.
If he's truly hungry enough to eat 10 nuggets, and I only give him 6, he'll graze once we get home.
He definitely doesn't dictate when or how often we go to McD's (we don't go that often, IMO, maybe once or twice a month), so I don't feel that him deciding what he wants to eat will be a disservice. Removing his internal gauge of what he needs to eat I think is a bigger disservice.
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| Posted 12/1/11 11:23 AM |
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NervousNell
Just another chapter in life..
Member since 11/09 54921 total posts
Name:
..being a mommy and being a wife!
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by GoldenRod
Although, on the Top 10 fattiest foods list, there's a 5 Guys burger, but nothing from McD's.
This I believe.
I once got a burger from Five Guys and it was the greasiest most disgusting thing I ever ate.
And I am a HUGE junk food eater.
I got sick afterwards.
And I eat McD's with no issues.
I don't see 5 guys as being any healthier than McD's.
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| Posted 12/1/11 11:24 AM |
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HoneyBadger
YourWorstNightmare.
Member since 10/06 15979 total posts
Name:
BahBahBlackJeep
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by GoldenRod
He has amazing control over how hungry he is. If he says he's hungry, he's truly hungry. I haven't seen many kids like him. He only eats when he's hungry, and stops when he's full. He's the perfect weight, he exercises a lot, he eats plenty of healthy food, and will turn down sweets. For Halloween, he chose to give out candy at the house, rather than collect candy, since he didn't want any.
I'm trying to instill good habits with him, and when he is able to decide what he *needs* to eat, rather than what I give him, I believe it will benefit him for the rest of his life in a positive way. Growing up, I didn't have much fast food, so I ate "healthier", but I was forced to clean my plate at every meal. That's still stuck with me, even though I know it's a major reason why I'm overweight. Eating too much "healthy" food isn't good either.
If he's truly hungry enough to eat 10 nuggets, and I only give him 6, he'll graze once we get home.
He definitely doesn't dictate when or how often we go to McD's (we don't go that often, IMO, maybe once or twice a month), so I don't feel that him deciding what he wants to eat will be a disservice. Removing his internal gauge of what he needs to eat I think is a bigger disservice.
I agree, going to McDonald's once or twice a month isn't very often, I was just wondering why you'd buy him the larger meal simply based on the fact that he doesn't like the toy.
Like, if you had said there are times, regardless of what they're giving away - whether he likes the toy or not, he wants the bigger meal because he's really hungry, I'd get that. But just going in for the bigger meal simply because he doesn't like the toy being given with the happy meal didn't make sense to me as it contradicted what you were saying about him being the kind of kid who doesn't over eat or under eat. Ya dig?
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| Posted 12/1/11 11:32 AM |
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Sparrow
LIF Adult
Member since 11/10 6826 total posts
Name:
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Maybe things have changed a lot since I was little but growing up I never had free reign to order whatever my heart desired off any menu. If we went to McDonald's or another fast food place on a rare occasion (which was almost always only because we were in a big rush or it was an only option on a road trip type of situation) I would be TOLD to choose one of the happy meal options and it sill had to be approved by my parents as far as if it was at least the healthiest option available. I can also clearly remember being told which meals I had to choose from when in a real restaurant. If I wanted something else from the menu I always had to run it by my parents and they would determine if it was a healthy choice or not. This had much more to do with nutrition content than portion size.
Do parents now consider it oppressive to limit a kid's choices at a restaurant?
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| Posted 12/1/11 11:39 AM |
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GoldenRod
10 years on LIF!
Member since 11/06 26792 total posts
Name:
Shawn
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Re: McDonald's skirts Happy Meal toy ban
Posted by Jennie0898
Posted by GoldenRod
He has amazing control over how hungry he is. If he says he's hungry, he's truly hungry. I haven't seen many kids like him. He only eats when he's hungry, and stops when he's full. He's the perfect weight, he exercises a lot, he eats plenty of healthy food, and will turn down sweets. For Halloween, he chose to give out candy at the house, rather than collect candy, since he didn't want any.
I'm trying to instill good habits with him, and when he is able to decide what he *needs* to eat, rather than what I give him, I believe it will benefit him for the rest of his life in a positive way. Growing up, I didn't have much fast food, so I ate "healthier", but I was forced to clean my plate at every meal. That's still stuck with me, even though I know it's a major reason why I'm overweight. Eating too much "healthy" food isn't good either.
If he's truly hungry enough to eat 10 nuggets, and I only give him 6, he'll graze once we get home.
He definitely doesn't dictate when or how often we go to McD's (we don't go that often, IMO, maybe once or twice a month), so I don't feel that him deciding what he wants to eat will be a disservice. Removing his internal gauge of what he needs to eat I think is a bigger disservice.
I agree, going to McDonald's once or twice a month isn't very often, I was just wondering why you'd buy him the larger meal simply based on the fact that he doesn't like the toy.
Like, if you had said there are times, regardless of what they're giving away - whether he likes the toy or not, he wants the bigger meal because he's really hungry, I'd get that. But just going in for the bigger meal simply because he doesn't like the toy being given with the happy meal didn't make sense to me as it contradicted what you were saying about him being the kind of kid who doesn't over eat or under eat. Ya dig?
There's a lot of things he does that I don't always understand.... However, in this category, I'm not messing with what I think is a good thing at the moment. I observe his eating habits, and as soon as what he's doing seems to go against his "eating only when hungry" mode, I'll step in. I realize it may not make a lot of sense to outside observers, but I'm very conscious of bad eating habits (I have too many of them to not be aware.... ), so I'm trying to not put rules on food, just boundaries (We're NOT going to McD's 5 times a week, no matter how hungry he says he is... )
For my family, this is what is working, and I truly believe that for my DS, this is in his best interest. It may not work at all with other kids, but right now, it is working well, so I'm not going to mess with it. I honestly think if I was allowed to eat the way DS eats when I was his age, I would have a lot less eating issues and weight issues now.
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| Posted 12/1/11 11:45 AM |
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