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When will this all end???!!!

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JennP
LIF Adult

Member since 10/06

3143 total posts

Name:
Jenn

Re: When will this all end???!!!

Posted by KateBennetReel

Posted by mrsrainbow

Posted by DancinBarefoot

Posted by blu6385

when are we allowed to go back to normal, with not having to wear masks, restaurants can be fully opened, movie theaters, sports, schools etc?

Nobody actually knows the answer to this question.

What needs to be achieved? How does this end?

Again, nobody knows the answer to this question.

Why are these questions so hard to answer? To me there has to be something they are looking for to say ok its all good we can go back to living our normal daily lives. The answer of, they dont know should not be acceptable at this point. they have to be looking for something!!

The reality is that there are too many unknowns with this virus. At first it was thought that only symptomatic people could transmit the virus, so masks weren't thought to be necessary. Then it became apparent that asymptomatic people could transmit the virus, so masks were an effective way to help reduce the spread. Now there is a genuine question about whether or not the virus is aerosolized, and how that affects transmission indoors. It was believed the children were not as susceptible to the virus, and didn't easily transmit it to others. Recent research (and what is going on in countries that opened schools) show that isn't true. There are so many unknowns which make your questions difficult, if not impossible to answer. Add to that, if someone gave a metric today, and then research showed it was the wrong metric, people would be screaming that they had been lied to, or mislead, or betrayed or whatever.

I asked the governors office and the response was generic and gave no answer.

Herd immunity? In the conference today they said they dont know if thats effective and how long people are really immune to it. So seems like thats not the answer.

Are they hoping its going to go away on its own?

They might be. Who knows. SARS and MERS - which were both coronoviruses did essentially go away. The Spanish flu took 2 years to die out though.

Is it the vaccine (which I asked when i send the message to the governors office) ?


I think if they were actually clear on what needs to happen to say ok we can go back to normal; people would probably more willing to cooperate and be less resistant on listening to what rules are being in place.

I disagree with this completely. I think if they (whoever the they is in this scenario) said that globally there needs to be no new infections for 10 days, or nationwide for 14 days people would freak out. This country has too many selfish people, and too many uneducated people. By that last statement I mean that the nation's educational system has eroded so significantly in the last 50 or so years, that not all children are taught critical thinking, they are not all taught to exam the world around them, they are not all taught how amazing science can be etc. People who do not have the education to understand and except science, are more likely to be skeptical of medical professionals and scientists, and more apt to believe conspiracy theorists because those conspiracy theories fit into their world view.






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I cannot love this post enough. Beautifully said.

I believe we would hear about (and therefore know about) the required 14 day metric much more often in the media if we weren't so far from it. But there is no light at the end of the tunnel right now for the US.

This phenomenon goes beyond Covid. Climate change comes to mind.

The uneducated (at least the ones who presume their ignorance is as good as the educated's knowledge) in concert with the selfish will, if left unchecked, have us all buried long before we should have been.

Posted 7/21/20 6:31 PM
 
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valentinesbaby
LIF Adult

Member since 2/20

900 total posts

Name:
Valentines

Re: When will this all end???!!!

People who do not have the education to understand and except science, are more likely to be skeptical of medical professionals and scientists, and more apt to believe conspiracy theorists because those conspiracy theories fit into their world view.


Or maybe they are realists who are educated and older who look beyond what people just tell them.
Kids of today question things and while I don’t agree with many of it I do see where they are coming from. This world is seen so differently from their eyes. They came into a world of evil and can’t believe that people can not be fake.

With what is coming out everyday how can you not question anything?

Posted 7/21/20 6:41 PM
 

JennP
LIF Adult

Member since 10/06

3143 total posts

Name:
Jenn

Re: When will this all end???!!!

Posted by valentinesbaby

People who do not have the education to understand and except science, are more likely to be skeptical of medical professionals and scientists, and more apt to believe conspiracy theorists because those conspiracy theories fit into their world view.


Or maybe they are realists who are educated and older who look beyond what people just tell them.
Kids of today question things and while I don’t agree with many of it I do see where they are coming from. This world is seen so differently from their eyes. They came into a world of evil and can’t believe that people can not be fake.

With what is coming out everyday how can you not question anything?



I think we have different definitions of what it means to question something.

Questioning something that is above my head means evaluating the source.

Is the url a .com, .edu, .info, etc.? All of those have different implications.

Is the writer an expert? Are the conclusions based on a study? Is it peer reviewed? If the science is controversial, what are the qualifications of the opposition?

Those are just some examples of questions to ask yourself when determining credibility.

That type of questioning is not just a good idea, it is essential.

Believers in junk science and conspiracy theorists are those who eschew science in the name of theories of the uneducated and/or internet rumors.

To me, that's not questioning. That's believing that "my ignorance is as good as your knowledge."

Posted 7/21/20 7:47 PM
 

valentinesbaby
LIF Adult

Member since 2/20

900 total posts

Name:
Valentines

Re: When will this all end???!!!

Posted by JennP

Posted by valentinesbaby

People who do not have the education to understand and except science, are more likely to be skeptical of medical professionals and scientists, and more apt to believe conspiracy theorists because those conspiracy theories fit into their world view.


Or maybe they are realists who are educated and older who look beyond what people just tell them.
Kids of today question things and while I don’t agree with many of it I do see where they are coming from. This world is seen so differently from their eyes. They came into a world of evil and can’t believe that people can not be fake.

With what is coming out everyday how can you not question anything?



I think we have different definitions of what it means to question something.

Questioning something that is above my head means evaluating the source.

Is the url a .com, .edu, .info, etc.? All of those have different implications.

Is the writer an expert? Are the conclusions based on a study? Is it peer reviewed? If the science is controversial, what are the qualifications of the opposition?

Those are just some examples of questions to ask yourself when determining credibility.

That type of questioning is not just a good idea, it is essential.

Believers in junk science and conspiracy theorists are those who eschew science in the name of theories of the uneducated and/or internet rumors.

To me, that's not questioning. That's believing that "my ignorance is as good as your knowledge."



I assume your kids are not teens or young adults lol. IME they are the ones who believe most in conspiracy theories.
Older people also know that not all things are black and white. Especially with this virus.

Posted 7/21/20 10:25 PM
 

seaside
LIF Adult

Member since 6/08

2717 total posts

Name:

Re: When will this all end???!!!

Posted by JennP

Posted by valentinesbaby

People who do not have the education to understand and except science, are more likely to be skeptical of medical professionals and scientists, and more apt to believe conspiracy theorists because those conspiracy theories fit into their world view.


Or maybe they are realists who are educated and older who look beyond what people just tell them.
Kids of today question things and while I don’t agree with many of it I do see where they are coming from. This world is seen so differently from their eyes. They came into a world of evil and can’t believe that people can not be fake.

With what is coming out everyday how can you not question anything?



I think we have different definitions of what it means to question something.

Questioning something that is above my head means evaluating the source.

Is the url a .com, .edu, .info, etc.? All of those have different implications.

Is the writer an expert? Are the conclusions based on a study? Is it peer reviewed? If the science is controversial, what are the qualifications of the opposition?

Those are just some examples of questions to ask yourself when determining credibility.

That type of questioning is not just a good idea, it is essential.

Believers in junk science and conspiracy theorists are those who eschew science in the name of theories of the uneducated and/or internet rumors.

To me, that's not questioning. That's believing that "my ignorance is as good as your knowledge."



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Posted 7/22/20 12:37 PM
 

Christine2
LIF Adult

Member since 2/09

1074 total posts

Name:

Re: When will this all end???!!!

I for one do not just accept information we are force fed to believe. I believe you should think for yourself, given the information presented and your own knowledge. Saying anyone not believing in mainstream thoughts is an ignoramous is just obnoxious. I for one have three degrees (in "hardcore" sciences), just saying...

Posted 7/22/20 2:14 AM
 

valentinesbaby
LIF Adult

Member since 2/20

900 total posts

Name:
Valentines

Re: When will this all end???!!!

Posted by Christine2

I for one do not just accept information we are force fed to believe. I believe you should think for yourself, given the information presented and your own knowledge. Saying anyone not believing in mainstream thoughts is an ignoramous is just obnoxious. I for one have three degrees (in "hardcore" sciences), just saying...



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Posted 7/22/20 6:56 AM
 

Jenn79
One more?

Member since 2/12

2367 total posts

Name:

Re: When will this all end???!!!

Posted by JennP

Posted by valentinesbaby

People who do not have the education to understand and except science, are more likely to be skeptical of medical professionals and scientists, and more apt to believe conspiracy theorists because those conspiracy theories fit into their world view.


Or maybe they are realists who are educated and older who look beyond what people just tell them.
Kids of today question things and while I don’t agree with many of it I do see where they are coming from. This world is seen so differently from their eyes. They came into a world of evil and can’t believe that people can not be fake.

With what is coming out everyday how can you not question anything?



I think we have different definitions of what it means to question something.

Questioning something that is above my head means evaluating the source.

Is the url a .com, .edu, .info, etc.? All of those have different implications.

Is the writer an expert? Are the conclusions based on a study? Is it peer reviewed? If the science is controversial, what are the qualifications of the opposition?

Those are just some examples of questions to ask yourself when determining credibility.

That type of questioning is not just a good idea, it is essential.

Believers in junk science and conspiracy theorists are those who eschew science in the name of theories of the uneducated and/or internet rumors.

To me, that's not questioning. That's believing that "my ignorance is as good as your knowledge."



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This is the new thing I’ve heard lately. People saying what’s so bad about questioning everything. (while sending/posting YouTube videos from their “research”) I couldn’t put into words an answer for it, although I knew it had one. This is perfectly stated.

Posted 7/22/20 9:02 AM
 

JennP
LIF Adult

Member since 10/06

3143 total posts

Name:
Jenn

Re: When will this all end???!!!

Posted by valentinesbaby

Posted by JennP

Posted by valentinesbaby

People who do not have the education to understand and except science, are more likely to be skeptical of medical professionals and scientists, and more apt to believe conspiracy theorists because those conspiracy theories fit into their world view.


Or maybe they are realists who are educated and older who look beyond what people just tell them.
Kids of today question things and while I don’t agree with many of it I do see where they are coming from. This world is seen so differently from their eyes. They came into a world of evil and can’t believe that people can not be fake.

With what is coming out everyday how can you not question anything?



I think we have different definitions of what it means to question something.

Questioning something that is above my head means evaluating the source.

Is the url a .com, .edu, .info, etc.? All of those have different implications.

Is the writer an expert? Are the conclusions based on a study? Is it peer reviewed? If the science is controversial, what are the qualifications of the opposition?

Those are just some examples of questions to ask yourself when determining credibility.

That type of questioning is not just a good idea, it is essential.

Believers in junk science and conspiracy theorists are those who eschew science in the name of theories of the uneducated and/or internet rumors.

To me, that's not questioning. That's believing that "my ignorance is as good as your knowledge."



I assume your kids are not teens or young adults lol. IME they are the ones who believe most in conspiracy theories.
Older people also know that not all things are black and white. Especially with this virus.




I have a ten year old, but I taught high school social studies for 9 years and I'm still in a school out of the classroom.

Teaching students to think critically was, quite literally, my number one academic priority.

IME, teenagers are no better or worse than adults.

But then again, every student who comes through my social studies department learns how to evaluate a source. To me, that skill is exactly what is necessary to "not see things in black and white."

Posted 7/22/20 10:25 AM
 

seaside
LIF Adult

Member since 6/08

2717 total posts

Name:

Re: When will this all end???!!!

I love how conspiracy theorists will scold you to "do your research," when they can't distinguish between a peer reviewed study and some paranoid, uneducated attention seeker making videos in his basement.
Or between consensus in the scientific community and a foreign bot trying to whip people in this country up and turn them against each other to act against their own best interests.

Or how they will shame you for "being a sheep" when you have the training and education to evaluate evidence for yourself, while they are blindly listening to anyone and anything that fits a narrative or sounds subversive.

It is the ultimate irony. And we are all worse off for it. Especially now.

Message edited 7/22/2020 11:03:40 AM.

Posted 7/22/20 10:57 AM
 

mrsrainbow
LIF Adult

Member since 1/17

1168 total posts

Name:

Re: When will this all end???!!!

Posted by seaside

I love how conspiracy theorists will scold you to "do your research," when they can't distinguish between a peer reviewed study and some paranoid, uneducated attention seeker making videos in his basement.
Or between consensus in the scientific community and a foreign bot trying to whip people in this country up and turn them against each other to act against their own best interests.

Or how they will shame you for "being a sheep" when you have the training and education to evaluate evidence for yourself, while they are blindly listening to anyone and anything that fits a narrative or sounds subversive.

It is the ultimate irony. And we are all worse off for it. Especially now.




And then when they are confronted with a completely rational and logical dialogue they say, "i don't blindly believe blah blah blah"

It is just Darwinism at work. The people who don't believe science will always, in the end, die off.

Posted 7/22/20 11:31 AM
 

Jenn79
One more?

Member since 2/12

2367 total posts

Name:

Re: When will this all end???!!!

Posted by seaside

I love how conspiracy theorists will scold you to "do your research," when they can't distinguish between a peer reviewed study and some paranoid, uneducated attention seeker making videos in his basement.
Or between consensus in the scientific community and a foreign bot trying to whip people in this country up and turn them against each other to act against their own best interests.

Or how they will shame you for "being a sheep" when you have the training and education to evaluate evidence for yourself, while they are blindly listening to anyone and anything that fits a narrative or sounds subversive.

It is the ultimate irony. And we are all worse off for it. Especially now.





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Posted 7/22/20 12:17 PM
 

soontobemommyof2
My boys...my everything <3

Member since 4/15

2264 total posts

Name:

Re: When will this all end???!!!

Posted by JennP

Posted by valentinesbaby

People who do not have the education to understand and except science, are more likely to be skeptical of medical professionals and scientists, and more apt to believe conspiracy theorists because those conspiracy theories fit into their world view.


Or maybe they are realists who are educated and older who look beyond what people just tell them.
Kids of today question things and while I don’t agree with many of it I do see where they are coming from. This world is seen so differently from their eyes. They came into a world of evil and can’t believe that people can not be fake.

With what is coming out everyday how can you not question anything?



I think we have different definitions of what it means to question something.

Questioning something that is above my head means evaluating the source.

Is the url a .com, .edu, .info, etc.? All of those have different implications.

Is the writer an expert? Are the conclusions based on a study? Is it peer reviewed? If the science is controversial, what are the qualifications of the opposition?

Those are just some examples of questions to ask yourself when determining credibility.

That type of questioning is not just a good idea, it is essential.

Believers in junk science and conspiracy theorists are those who eschew science in the name of theories of the uneducated and/or internet rumors.

To me, that's not questioning. That's believing that "my ignorance is as good as your knowledge."



U are aware that if someone let’s say in the medical field brings up questions/concerns or finds something and is advising further studies to be done will most of the time not be taken in such positive way right? It’s a bold move from their part to bring light to something that has been stablished and it’s already accepted. U most likely won’t find their findings in a famous peer reviewed website. These ppl know that making this public comes with a risk for their careers, for their credibilities. Some might take the risk and some won’t. I know plenty of ppl whose reputation have been distroyed because they decided to speak up about their findings or call for further research. But they know that being public is the way to bring awareness about something. Look at the things we used to believe were totally safe like smoking for example (during pregnancy, indoors, etc) and how much resistance was found at the very beginning when ppl in the medical field started noticing that indeed it’s not safe. Same thing happens with drugs, with our food. Our sources should not only be from urls that have an -edu in them, or come from a famous peer reviewed website. We should be able to dig deeper, analyze who’s behind the piece we’re studying, what are the motives, what kind of work has that person done in the past, look into the info given like data, historical facts, statistics, what are the elements provided. Then look further and reach out to other sources for corroboration, comparison, etc. Believing someone just because he’s the “expert” is not critical thinking and sadly it’s a skill that it’s rarely taught anymore.

Message edited 7/22/2020 11:00:50 PM.

Posted 7/22/20 10:57 PM
 

JennP
LIF Adult

Member since 10/06

3143 total posts

Name:
Jenn

Re: When will this all end???!!!

Posted by soontobemommyof2

Posted by JennP

Posted by valentinesbaby

People who do not have the education to understand and except science, are more likely to be skeptical of medical professionals and scientists, and more apt to believe conspiracy theorists because those conspiracy theories fit into their world view.


Or maybe they are realists who are educated and older who look beyond what people just tell them.
Kids of today question things and while I don’t agree with many of it I do see where they are coming from. This world is seen so differently from their eyes. They came into a world of evil and can’t believe that people can not be fake.

With what is coming out everyday how can you not question anything?



I think we have different definitions of what it means to question something.

Questioning something that is above my head means evaluating the source.

Is the url a .com, .edu, .info, etc.? All of those have different implications.

Is the writer an expert? Are the conclusions based on a study? Is it peer reviewed? If the science is controversial, what are the qualifications of the opposition?

Those are just some examples of questions to ask yourself when determining credibility.

That type of questioning is not just a good idea, it is essential.

Believers in junk science and conspiracy theorists are those who eschew science in the name of theories of the uneducated and/or internet rumors.

To me, that's not questioning. That's believing that "my ignorance is as good as your knowledge."



U are aware that if someone let’s say in the medical field brings up questions/concerns or finds something and is advising further studies to be done will most of the time not be taken in such positive way right? It’s a bold move from their part to bring light to something that has been stablished and it’s already accepted. U most likely won’t find their findings in a famous peer reviewed website. These ppl know that making this public comes with a risk for their careers, for their credibilities. Some might take the risk and some won’t. I know plenty of ppl whose reputation have been distroyed because they decided to speak up about their findings or call for further research. But they know that being public is the way to bring awareness about something. Look at the things we used to believe were totally safe like smoking for example (during pregnancy, indoors, etc) and how much resistance was found at the very beginning when ppl in the medical field started noticing that indeed it’s not safe. Same thing happens with drugs, with our food. Our sources should not only be from urls that have an -edu in them, or come from a famous peer reviewed website. We should be able to dig deeper, analyze who’s behind the piece we’re studying, what are the motives, what kind of work has that person done in the past, look into the info given like data, historical facts, statistics, what are the elements provided. Then look further and reach out to other sources for corroboration, comparison, etc. Believing someone just because he’s the “expert” is not critical thinking and sadly it’s a skill that it’s rarely taught anymore.



Did you read what I wrote? Because people absolutely SHOULD dig deeper and look at all of the things you mentioned. I listed a few questions and said that they were "some examples."

My post, along with similar ones, is in response to people who are not listening to any type of credible science, people who are buying into internet rumors and calling it "research", people who post articles from very biased websites, and people who believe in conspiracy theories that have been debunked 10 times over. Those people are NOT thinking critically.

I think this is so important that I've refrained from sharing things that I actually agree with if the source looked dubious or if it was worded absurdly. But many don't bother and that's how nonsense circulates all over the place.

Posted 7/22/20 11:14 PM
 
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